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A question to those that still raid in LOTRO

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I was on my server earlier and a raid announced that they had just beaten Saruman tier 1. After all the gratz and general sucking up I mentioned in GLFF that I didn't realize that beating a raid on tier 1 deserved an announcement. It never had before. How do I know this? I have been the raid progression thread keeper on my server since DN.

Now what I really wanted to say was, has this server gotten so low with all the hard core raiders leaving the game that a tier 1 kill is celebrated? I really wasn't trying to troll the raid, I don't know who leads it and I don't really care. I did ask how many had beaten the raid game wide and was told that none have. I checked and found out that it was true. I did apologize to the raid and wished them good luck on their further progression.

My question is this. Is the raid that hard or have all the hard core raiders left? I suspect its a both, but how much of each? A quick perusal of the Raid and Instance thread indicates that a lot of the usuals are gone. In fact the OP of the raid progression thread is a friend of mine from Nim and a former member of my Alliance raid. This would be a key indicator of the health of this game IMHO.

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Why would you not congratulate someone on something they have worked hard to achieve? Even if you think Saurman tier 1 is easy does the other group not deserve some "gratz" for finishing it?

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Pretty sure hardcore raiders have left.

On my server, the big kins have still to do Saruman T2 HM. Had this been any other raid, they'd have done it by now. They're also losing players (info from a few people who are still in those kins).

Even my own kin has lost a handful of core raiders, resulting in us not even being able to do T2 Orthanc. We barely get the sign ups. There's a steady stream of long time members who are leaving us now, just like a lot of kins on my server. Now the new lag from update 6 has gotten so bad, people in my kin won't even bother trying to raid now.

It's weird but when SW:TOR came out, it really did hit the game harder than people will admit. Adding that RoI was so terrible, Turbine pretty much just said 'no need to play here anymore'.

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wow, my response to your post doesn't even answer your question, sorry about that. In my defence I was so drunk I don't even remember posting it!

You are right, previously tier 1 raid clearances would be the norm and a daily occurance, I guess just filling enough to attempt the raid is in itself an achievment now!

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Pretty sure hardcore raiders have left.

Hardcore raiders had already left by the end of SoA. When I returned for Moria/MW I had the impression only casuals and family guys were left playing. That was on a RP server tho, so the view might be skewed.

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JWBarry didn't want the new raid beaten too fast since it's going to be a long time until the next raid is released. Apparently, his idea of extending content is having us continuously wipe trying to beat it. End result, people have stopped even trying.

Fire & Frost T2 Challenge and Saruman T2 both have an INSANE amount of AOE damage.

It *might* be possible to beat Saruman T2, but you have to spend 20 minutes doing the first 4 boring phases just to be wiped within 30-60 seconds in phase 5. It's hard to get 12 people to put in many attempts because of that. The challenge for Saruman T2 is that nobody can die, we won't see anyone accomplish that until level 85 unless it's nerfed.

Fire and Frost Challenge requires a ton of DPS, a ton of CC and several tons of healing. It's mathematically impossible.

The other problem... loot. There are only a couple of jewelery pieces, 1st ages & Saruman's clasp (50% drop rate on T1 now). You can get all of the armor by simply running T1 once then grinding seals & medallions (no T2 set armor). The loot table is also stuffed full of trash non-set armor and cloaks. We beat shadow challenge and got 3 bad warden armor pieces and a bad cloak. (Rockx, the loot dude, plays a warden on the test servers BTW). That chest was typical until this latest update. With the update the warden gear drops less & 1st ages drop more, but the best jewelry pieces have been nerfed. People were also upset when the door to the last 2 bosses disappeared with the update and took a week and a half to be fixed.

The typical kin now just farms lightning challenge for 1st ages, does the rest on T1, and farms Saruman T1 for clasps. My kin still does Acid challenge & Shadow challenge; but some people are grumbling that they would rather just skip that and do more alt runs of Saruman T1 instead.

As for the original question, the first time a group beats Saruman T1 it is a big deal. When phase 5 hits and those 10 Saruman clones spawn it's utter chaos. Not at all a big deal for a server to see a Saruman T1 kill though, most raiding kins and a lot of pugs have been beating it for months.

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It's relative.

If some group thinks it's a noteworthy accomplishment and wants to put it out there, I say big deal. Let them have their moment, you can choose to ignore it.

Largely agree with Toe overall. My kin is at about the same point. F/F T2 we did once just to do it and we do Acid CH because it takes about 2 minutes if we're on, but otherwise it's been lots of Lightning CH and T1 Sarumans.

Overall, loot isn't a viable motivation in LotRO's raids at present for the most part and like Toe said, there's some serious issues with the practicality of a couple fights. I'm lucky that my kin has largely been able to stay together thru TOR but if the only remaining options are bashing our heads against the wall in impossible fights, who knows how long it'll stay that way.

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This is exactly the problem. There is no incentive to do that raid once you've done the lot on T1 because it's just so ridiculously hard and so tedious getting to it. Why waste 3 hours wiping on trash and killing a boss when all you get is trash loot and nothing else?

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Why would you not congratulate someone on something they have worked hard to achieve? Even if you think Saurman tier 1 is easy does the other group not deserve some "gratz" for finishing it?

I did gratz them, but I still think my question was a legitimate one. I don't recall celebrations for tier 1 OD kills, most hard core raiding kins went straight to tier 2.

Oops, didn't see your 2nd post :)

Hardcore raiders had already left by the end of SoA. When I returned for Moria/MW I had the impression only casuals and family guys were left playing. That was on a RP server tho, so the view might be skewed.

Not true on my server. I didn't even start raiding until Watcher. Did Rift a few times in SoA, but I was in a very casual kin back then. Nim is a smallish server, but still had at least 4 kins that cleared DN and BG regularly and IIRC a kin that had world 3rd HM clear in OD.

Ugh, glad I'm not doing it then. Every raid the gear gets worse and worse. I didn't raid solely for loot, but everyone wants a brass ring to grab hold of.

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I was on my server earlier and a raid announced that they had just beaten Saruman tier 1. After all the gratz and general sucking up I mentioned in GLFF that I didn't realize that beating a raid on tier 1 deserved an announcement. It never had before. How do I know this? I have been the raid progression thread keeper on my server since DN.

Now what I really wanted to say was, has this server gotten so low with all the hard core raiders leaving the game that a tier 1 kill is celebrated? I really wasn't trying to troll the raid, I don't know who leads it and I don't really care.

Of course you were trolling. You took the time to try to publicly belittle them being happy for their achievement. If you were simply curious you would have pm'd people. You instead chose to troll them in GLFF.

Maybe try to be happy for people when they feel they've accomplished something. No need to be an ass.

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Of course you were trolling. You took the time to try to publicly belittle them being happy for their achievement. If you were simply curious you would have pm'd people. You instead chose to troll them in GLFF.

Maybe try to be happy for people when they feel they've accomplished something. No need to be an ass.

I bet you're the kind of person that gives people 'grats' on ranking up. Every. Single. Time.

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Of course not. I'll just keep quiet rather than try to make someone feel bad.

I can't help but feel the need to mock the person parading their 'achievement' about. Even people advertising their server firsts just sound like public masturbation to me.

If they don't want to be mocked, don't broadcast it to hundreds of people who don't care.

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Well, if you must know, it wasn't anyone in the raid that announced it. I know I said the raid announced it, but I didn't think I would have to go into details of the personalities of everyone on my server, it wasn't relevent to the question I was asking. It was someone that has only been playing for a year and has managed to exploit every raid he's led. So yes, I was trolling the person that announced it, but he wasn't in the raid. Hey, I like putting things out in the open on my server, its how you find out who's an exploiter/farmer/cheater in the community. I've exposed quite a few on my server. Being a troll works wonders in that department.

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Of course not. I'll just keep quiet rather than try to make someone feel bad.

I agree with your sentiment nominally, but ultimately, as soon as you make a statement on a public channel, you have to be prepared to cop some flak, because that's the way it is.

Not saying if it's right or wrong. Just the fact that it happens.

Being British, cynical and generally a bastard, I would be hard pressed not to type something like "What do you want, a medal?" to someone stating on a global channel that they had just achieved a server first.

I lump this into sort of thing into the same category as people bringing their baby photos into work.

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I really like the Orthanc raid - i like that it is hard to do. It is not so much about the loot - there is really nothing except for the first agers that i would need from T2. To beat Saruman T1 is really an achievement for this raid.

T2 is a completely other story - i think only our raid and one other have beat more than one T2 boss on Anduin. From our raid many have left the game after the OD was farmed for much too long. Only one or two have left for sw:tor - and at least one of them is back.

And for the global list: i do not have a problem if someone tells about their achievements. For everyone it depends and i will surely gz for some raid having their first Saruman "kill".

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If Turbine keeps treating people the way they are doing lately pretty soon only F2P will be left to play the game. I am just waiting for GW2 to come out and kiss LOTRO bye. The amount of medallions needed to get a decent set is ridiculous, some of the quest lines are becoming a freaking killing feast. I log in my 75 and go like, oh man do I really want to do this tonight? I just shut down the computer or change toon to my lev 20 warden, really dont feel like playing high levels.

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If Turbine keeps treating people the way they are doing lately pretty soon only F2P will be left to play the game. I am just waiting for GW2 to come out and kiss LOTRO bye. The amount of medallions needed to get a decent set is ridiculous, some of the quest lines are becoming a freaking killing feast. I log in my 75 and go like, oh man do I really want to do this tonight? I just shut down the computer or change toon to my lev 20 warden, really dont feel like playing high levels.

As much as I'm growing weary of end game and all its grinding, I still enjoy the lower level stuff too. That's the one benefit of my Lifer account; I can log in whenever I like and just play my under 30's.

But I'll be going straight to GW2 too, so I'll see you there!

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The way "Update 666" seems to have bollocksed up the game, it might not even take GW2 (or D3, or a game of hopscotch outside on the sidewalk) to drive players away. I've never seen anything like this in all the time I've played, and last night all I was doing was crafting. Or attempting to.

;)

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The lag is pretty awful, even with something as simple as trying to ride a stable horse from point A to point B. I play on a sub-par computer, so I notice the lag effects of the game more than most, like how a goat that another player is riding will cause me to pause for a few seconds or how the above-the-head text pop-ups for NPC's (which I would love to be able to turn off) give the same pause. So, for me, the Update 6 lag doesn't exactly lend itself to making rudimentary things like, oh, combat and general movement any easier.

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So U6 is not ready for Prime Time, I take it?

Well, let's put it this way...if the issues now plaguing the game are handled the same way as the issues that have plagued the community site...we're never going to get to Mordor. Or Gondor. Or the rest of Rohan.

The bloggers are all singing "Welcome to my World". I wonder if I can teach my minstrel to play that.

:D

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I agree with your sentiment nominally, but ultimately, as soon as you make a statement on a public channel, you have to be prepared to cop some flak, because that's the way it is.

Not saying if it's right or wrong. Just the fact that it happens.

Being British, cynical and generally a bastard, I would be hard pressed not to type something like "What do you want, a medal?" to someone stating on a global channel that they had just achieved a server first.

I lump this into sort of thing into the same category as people bringing their baby photos into work.

I don’t think you would have survived long on Gilrain, when it still had a community.

There are many gaming communities (not naming the MMOs!) which take much more kindly to "tough-guy masturbation" on global chat, than we used to. A little bit of manners was a pre-req there, now I have the global chat switched off mostly.

To come back to the OP – no Saruman T2 was killed on Gilrain.

3-4 top kins do T2 challenge on other bosses, the rest just trod along on T1, yawning slightly. Still - T1 Saruman is a good fight, with a good final wave, and any kin that does it deserves congratulations warmer than if they had just defeated Gurvand.

Being happy is OK, unless it flows from torturing little kids who have downed some mini-boss.

Oh, and hello. :)

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I don’t think you would have survived long on Gilrain, when it still had a community.

I've been on Gilrain since 2008 and I "survive" just fine. Happy to say what I want, when I want, which is for most of the time courteous.

The inference of your comments is that the community would chastise me for my lack of support and sarcasm toward their achievements?

What a risible notion. However, even if it strove to do so, would I care?

Out of idle curiosity, when exactly did Gilrain have a community? Was there a town hall and did they regularly have meetings?

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