Turbine purges their post pledging "convenience not advantage" after putting store only relics for sale

[Brrokk]

I've tried PvP and would like to play it more, but I just can't get a decent frame rate. I think it's an internet issue rather than PC spec. I wander about happily, get into a mass fight, go down to about 1 frame per second and then find I'm dead.

If the whole world goes PvP I won't be able to cope with LOTRO anymore. I hope Turbine won't be daft enough to carve off a chunk of their player-base like that.

[Blaize]

Nah, it'd involve far too much work on their part to actually balance the classes and that won't happen. I think you're safe for now!

[Vardiel]

To be fair, class balancing is hard. If it was simply PvP, but they have to consider PvE as well to some degree (freep side).

For now, and I'm not expecting things to change any time soon, I won't touch PvMP. Hopefully it will be a viable option one day.

[Podraig]

More Advantage coming to the store in ROI, reputation accelerater, get 5000 extra faction rep for 225 tp, way it works is it sits there and doubles any incomming faction rep until the full 5000 has been used, no time limit. While I have not tested fully on ROI, new area has task boards, level restricted ofc and limited as always with daily task ammount, I completed one of the first area's and recieved about 10k rep, enough to get me past neutral, friend ofc requires another 20k and ally another 25k then kindred another 30k, assuming same rep per area and 5-6 areas for dunland rep, we can assume that you probably need to run repeatables ie tasks to reach kindred rep limited to 5 per day for a extra 1500 rep or more if you have spent tp points on extra tasks or resets. I fear reaching kindred with riders of rohan will be alot harder soon as they only seem to have 2 areas for quests that I found, nan curinar where orthanc is has a Grey company camp, while I did not try any quests here, one would assume again its grey company rep soon as main quest giver is grey company.

[Laurinaohtar]

More Advantage coming to the store in ROI, reputation accelerater, get 5000 extra faction rep for 225 tp, way it works is it sits there and doubles any incomming faction rep until the full 5000 has been used, no time limit. While I have not tested fully on ROI, new area has task boards, level restricted ofc and limited as always with daily task ammount, I completed one of the first area's and recieved about 10k rep, enough to get me past neutral, friend ofc requires another 20k and ally another 25k then kindred another 30k, assuming same rep per area and 5-6 areas for dunland rep, we can assume that you probably need to run repeatables ie tasks to reach kindred rep limited to 5 per day for a extra 1500 rep or more if you have spent tp points on extra tasks or resets. I fear reaching kindred with riders of rohan will be alot harder soon as they only seem to have 2 areas for quests that I found, nan curinar where orthanc is has a Grey company camp, while I did not try any quests here, one would assume again its grey company rep soon as main quest giver is grey company.

This is the main issue I have with F2P, they have to make any grind extra long otherwise the store bought consumables to mitigate that grind wont be attractive enough. So for those of us that wont use these store bought consumables are left with the extra long grinds.

[frodofraggins]

How long is it going to take before Turbine learns to stop making promises they can't keep.

[Mockingbird]

This is the main issue I have with F2P, they have to make any grind extra long otherwise the store bought consumables to mitigate that grind wont be attractive enough. So for those of us that wont use these store bought consumables are left with the extra long grinds.

I have been thinking about this too. It makes sense in theory, however virtues back in SoA days used to be a long grind (trolls in sarnur etc) and while it was possible to buy rep on the auction house, the rep system itself was full of grind too. Although you could say that the rep rewards weren't as interesting (except cosmetically) in terms of needing kindred...

So can anyone name things that are significantly more grind since F2P than they were pre-F2P?

[Wayshuba]

Sounds to me like Turbine has now realized they have gone to far and are preparing for lawsuits. Why else would you start deleting public product information without proper market notification (which is also illegal!)?

[MarkJ]

I have been thinking about this too. It makes sense in theory, however virtues back in SoA days used to be a long grind (trolls in sarnur etc) and while it was possible to buy rep on the auction house, the rep system itself was full of grind too. Although you could say that the rep rewards weren't as interesting (except cosmetically) in terms of needing kindred...

So can anyone name things that are significantly more grind since F2P than they were pre-F2P?

Yes I can name a few things.

Reputation; It's now gated by a ridiculously low amount of daily repeatables and all the rep items are BOA.

The LI changes; With the changes to the relic system (and the inability to un-slot relics via game-play) the grind to get decent relics and shards is mind numbing. But you can buy some pretty nice relics at the Store, which you can throw away to buy again later right?

Armour Sets ; In Moria (and SOA) you ran the Raids and each chest dropped a coin. Turn in the coin and get the armour. Then came the OD armour pieces where you need the unique token from the chest AND a ridiculous number of medallions to obtain gear and the grind for the medallions are gated by dailies.

These are just a few things off the top of my head, I know there's more...

[terrorite]

Sounds to me like Turbine has now realized they have gone to far and are preparing for lawsuits. Why else would you start deleting public product information without proper market notification (which is also illegal!)?

In my opinion they are rather in bad financial state and trying to do anything to prevent their collapse. Healthy company with strong MMO title can of course ban some people from their boards but rather for simple reasons like abusive language, racism etc... You know, the dogs bark, but the caravan moves on.

But that case looks absolutely different when we talking about Turbine behaviour. Deleting criticizing threads, hiding inconvenient posts, misleading informations and false advertising and promotions is a sign of poor financial status. They dramatically need money and trying anything that can help them grab more cash. Even as ethically ambiguous things as infamous "convenience not sapience ehh... advantage", and simultaneously trying to hide inconvenient questions and facts.

Yes, i know, they stated "RoI is the best selling expansion", but that means nothing, "best selling" doesn't mean "highest profitable ever" because "income" is not equal to "profit".

Just my 2c.

[SellingTheDrama]

In my opinion they are rather in bad financial state and trying to do anything to prevent their collapse. Healthy company with strong MMO title can of course ban some people from their boards but rather for simple reasons like abusive language, racism etc... You know, the dogs bark, but the caravan moves on.

But that case looks absolutely different when we talking about Turbine behaviour. Deleting criticizing threads, hiding inconvenient posts, misleading informations and false advertising and promotions is a sign of poor financial status. They dramatically need money and trying anything that can help them grab more cash. Even as ethically ambiguous things as infamous "convenience not sapience ehh... advantage", and simultaneously trying to hide inconvenient questions and facts.

Yes, i know, they stated "RoI is the best selling expansion", but that means nothing, "best selling" doesn't mean "highest profitable ever" because "income" is not equal to "profit".

Just my 2c.

Or it could just be that Sap is an arse.

This stuff did not start until he took over for Patience and got worse once WB bought them.

I believe it is just a combination of a lil'despot and sleazy marketing types.

I also cannot see WB buying a failing company.

[Calendae]

Or it could just be that Sap is an arse.

This stuff did not start until he took over for Patience and got worse once WB bought them.

I believe it is just a combination of a lil'despot and sleazy marketing types.

I also cannot see WB buying a failing company.

other companies with similar stats were probably too expensive.

[Dalthalion]

According to Fernando Paiz, pay-to-win isn't so bad. To attempt to prove his point, he cites Electronic Arts' Battlefield Heroes ... yes, Battlefield Heroes. But, don't take my word for it; hear/see for yourselves.

[terrorite]

Or it could just be that Sap is an arse.

This stuff did not start until he took over for Patience and got worse once WB bought them.

I believe it is just a combination of a lil'despot and sleazy marketing types.

I also cannot see WB buying a failing company.

Yep, WB bought Turbine, it's a fact. But amount of money needed for maintain relatively small but "independent" in some aspects, company is irrelevant if we wanna talk about big companies as, for example, WB. So they bought Turbine and they want refund of costs as fast as possible. So more money going to WB, less to Turbine, simple. And Turbine is between a hammer and the anvil because larger income after f2p does not mean more cash for Turbine. Now they need money for maintain LotRo and money for WB. And remember that WB bought Turbine mainly for their online store code and i'm not sure if WB at all care about LotRo. Well, maybe only as a cash cow.

Anyway this is only my, absolutely subjective point of view.

Sapience, from the other hand, is a different thing. lead communist (heck! another freudian slip) i mean community specialist, hell, yeah!

[Spheric]

Once Warner Brothers (a subsidiary of mega-giant Time-Warner) acquired Turbine, there became a lot more mansions and yachts to be paid for. As terrorite has pointed out, Turbine could be making money hand-over-fist and it still might not be enough (is it ever?) for those guys.

[Beldacar]

Just in case Turbine lets google delete the cached site...

Ah, poor Patience .... probably actually believed that statement when posting it. Left not that long afterwards, too....

Maybe Patience had something Sapience doesn't. Let's call it "scruples," for lack of a better word ;

Once Warner Brothers (a subsidiary of mega-giant Time-Warner) acquired Turbine, there became a lot more mansions and yachts to be paid for. As terrorite has pointed out, Turbine could be making money hand-over-fist and it still might not be enough (is it ever?) for those guys.

I don't buy it. The bad behavior started long before Turbine was acquired by WB. Granted, it has gotten -worse- lately. But marketing "misstatements" have been occurring since the Mines of Moria era and the LOTRO store is essentially a rerun of the DDO store, which also dates back to before the acquisition by WB.

Perhaps Turbine's management is under more pressure now, but their methods have only changed in magnitude and frequency rather than style.

[terrorite]

Out of curiosity, who is now Senior Community Manager?

[LordVorontur]

Meghan was, is and will forever be a class-act. Got out of Turbine when she realised things aren't being done in a proper fashion. Called Jenks now. Not sure whether Rodbergh(sp) was her married name and she's gone back, or she's got hitched.

[SellingTheDrama]

Out of curiosity, who is now Senior Community Manager?

sapience.

he got hired to take over for patience as SCM for lotro while patience got promoted to SCM for turbine.

[Valandir]

re-uploaded the screenshot in post #7

[Silverangel]

How long is it going to take before Turbine learns to stop making promises they can't keep.

About a year and a half, apparently. The latest quote supposedly being:

Mersky: "We have no intention at this time of selling any raid gear in the store."

I know the thread is a necro, but it's still kind of funny. Thanks for re-posting the forum image, Valandir.

[Jackalope]

I like the picture of the two point cards for sale, the $10 dollar 1000 TP card clearly showing that buying two of them gets you 400 more TP than paying 1 penny less on a 19.99 card for 1600 TP. Marketing is CLEARLY not Turbines strong suit. It does show that they are aiming for PAY MORE, GET LESS.

[Doro]

I thought it was:

$10 for 750. Roughly 1.33 dollars per point.

$20 for 1600. Roughly 1.25 dollars per point

$25 for 2000. Roughly 1.25 dollars per point.

Unless there's some deal on currently that I'm luckily missing?

[Amphoras]

I like the picture of the two point cards for sale, the $10 dollar 1000 TP card clearly showing that buying two of them gets you 400 more TP than paying 1 penny less on a 19.99 card for 1600 TP. Marketing is CLEARLY not Turbines strong suit. It does show that they are aiming for PAY MORE, GET LESS.

I think this has been posted a few times before. Can't remember which, but the $10 card is actually a £10 or 10 euro card. Just people not looking properly at what symbol it has on it.

[LordVorontur]

Yep, they're just harping on about the fact you can buy the points cards in the UK now in WHSmiths and GAME.