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The Dead Marshes (Update 14.2 Beta)


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Uhm. Seems you got it mixed up there, buddy.

 

The bullshit is what has transpired in the OF over the last couple of months. Now that Heaton's gone, one can actually point out when the usual suspects go on a bullshit-spreading spree again.

This is what others and I did over the last couple of days. Calling them on it. Not for me personally, as I couldn't care less about the unrecognisable shadow of the former game itself, but the nonsense, double-standards, putting themselves up onto pedestals, as kickman appropriately called it, needs to stop for the sorry rest of the decent folks that STILL haven't given up.

 

SNy

SNy, I was right there alongside of you in a few cases, making the same argument.  Bullshit is bullshit, whether its here or over there.  Both should be called out.

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I generally just pop by here to see what's going on (aka, lurking with nothing to add), but I wouldn't feel too bad about complaining, or having lingering negativity toward Turbine.  I found this site

I just find it hilarious we've got two people (who've been here what a month?) trying to lay down their opinion to everyone else about what we can and can't discuss. Not only that, one is trying to sp

Agreed.    I know a lot of players on my server stopped helping with betas after Sap was so very rude about skill trees, etc. They became discouraged and disenchanted with the Mouth of Turbine basic

Ok, so I've heavily cropped the above quote but it's important to make a point here. As with anything else to do with history, we need to remember who Kate Paiz was, who Rick Heaton was in the context of LOTRO, because it was through their actions, their decisions, their behaviours that an absolutely fantastic MMO was degraded to the point where it lost its soul.

 

And without remembering, the lessons will never be learned.

 

Yup. What Bucko needs to understand that if it wasn't for Kate & Fernando Paiz, virtually none of us would be over here complaining about what a steaming piece of shit LotRO has turned into. Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it.

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I just find it hilarious we've got two people (who've been here what a month?) trying to lay down their opinion to everyone else about what we can and can't discuss. Not only that, one is trying to speak for everyone else about how weshould treat Quinn.

In light of that, here is my carefully crafted response!

43731-mr-rogers-middle-finger-gif-I7sN.g

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I just find it hilarious we've got two people (who've been here what a month?) trying to lay down their opinion to everyone else about what we can and can't discuss. Not only that, one is trying to speak for everyone else about how weshould treat Quinn.

In light of that, here is my carefully crafted response!

43731-mr-rogers-middle-finger-gif-I7sN.g

 

Doro, you are an island in a sea of madness. Never change.

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It really is.  Thank you!  

I already like you.  Back when WHH used to post I dubbed him Old Dirty Programmer (it's his gangsta rap name), so if you see the ODP reference it's dedicated to him.  I have dubbed DJ  Mrs. ODP.   The two of them are a couple of Heydters. 

 

It's posters like them and those of that ilk that have pushed us over to this site.  Much for the same reasons you mention.  Then Sap told us the only place our ideas would be listened to was his site.  Sadly no one of value wants to post there anymore.  Most of the time it erupts in flames on the same scale as the Chicago fire.  99% of the time ending in a solo vs Raider argument.

 

A real productive forum if you ask me!

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I think official forums have been ok lately. Sapience is gone, most of the self-appointed moderators are also gone or post less. There are a few trolls, but they aren't running the forum anymore.

This is just from page 1 general, So much flames it makes the California wild fires look tame.

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?555186-In-through-the-outdoor-and-WB-Games-Turbine

I failed to see the decreased posting in this one.

 

 

Beanie, SNy and a few others still post on the OF--some sanity amongst the chaos.

7 vs at minimum 30 to 40.   It used to be people used the forums to direct other players to online guides or provided them in the thread.  Also advice was given, opinions shared and suggestions made.  This is why I originally used the forum.   There was a point in time when you could not post a single topic without a solo vs raid war.   Even that poor person who suggested a hytbold in game guide was torched by the lynch squad. 

 

On a more positive note it looks as though RKL was banned or has gone on a break and if he was banned it was justice being served.  And yes I agree Kirmis that it has tamed down.  Mostly because the complainants have simply left or finally realized asking for anything PVP or Raiding wise wasn't going to be productive.  The forum is slowly getting back to normal.  BUT the posters who ruin it for others have been around for over 6, 7 years.  So their crusade is far from over.

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At the end of the day, Sapience did incredible damage to the game IMO. Condescending towards players, terrible at communicating and passing on information clearly, petty in his moderation, and intentionally polarizing the community and dividing it. Very damaging to the forum and game community.

 

Of course, even without him management would still have driven the game into the ground with their terrible project management (Big Battles? yeah that worked) and taking all the money out of Lotro and putting it in to Infinite Crisis. But still, Sapience made it so much worse, especially for players who used the forums.

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This is just from page 1 general, So much flames it makes the California wild fires look tame.

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?555186-In-through-the-outdoor-and-WB-Games-Turbine

I failed to see the decreased posting in this one.

You have flame posts on every forum, including this one. That forum is bigger, so it has more trolling. But they have far more reasonable discussion than a few months ago, criticism. A few months ago that thread wouldn't exist, it would've been deleted within a day. Now it not only exists, but trolls got bashed there, and nothing happened.

 

No more Sapience snarkiness, no more players "moderators" hunting evil critics. I don't know how many times I criticized different aspects of the game on that forum over the last month. Not one post got deleted, not one post got flamed. There's so much discussion there now, and most trolls seem to have given up. They show up sometimes. Trolls are a part of forums. I try to ignore them. As long as discussion is allowed to go on and trolls are just a feature, not the main course, it's fine. These trolls used to be "lotro elite", above all rules, immitating Sapience's communication style and under his protection while everyone else would get banned, now they aren't lotro's elite anymore, they are just trolls.

 

A few months ago there was no discussion. Server merging, talks about raids, criticism? Not allowed. Even posting server population numbers was not allowed, it would get deleted. And there was a bunch of fanboys smelling about-to-be-deleted posts like sharks smell blood, trolling them, reporting them. Now I see Mar-something complain about rude people, and no one cares. Trancejeremy is making rational posts criticising Turbine. Blue names are backing away from the 10% thing. Rational discussion. It's a different atmosphere.

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You have flame posts on every forum, including this one. That forum is bigger, so it has more trolling. But they have far more reasonable discussion than a few months ago, criticism. A few months ago that thread wouldn't exist, it would've been deleted within a day. Now it not only exists, but trolls got bashed there, and nothing happened.

 

No more Sapience snarkiness, no more players "moderators" hunting evil critics. I don't know how many times I criticized different aspects of the game on that forum over the last month. Not one post got deleted, not one post got flamed. There's so much discussion there now, and most trolls seem to have given up. They show up sometimes. Trolls are a part of forums. I try to ignore them. As long as discussion is allowed to go on and trolls are just a feature, not the main course, it's fine. These trolls used to be "lotro elite", above all rules, immitating Sapience's communication style and under his protection while everyone else would get banned, now they aren't lotro's elite anymore, they are just trolls.

 

A few months ago there was no discussion. Server merging, talks about raids, criticism? Not allowed. Even posting server population numbers was not allowed, it would get deleted. And there was a bunch of fanboys smelling about-to-be-deleted posts like sharks smell blood, trolling them, reporting them. Now I see Mar-something complain about rude people, and no one cares. Trancejeremy is making rational posts criticising Turbine. Blue names are backing away from the 10% thing. Rational discussion. It's a different atmosphere.

My own opinion of that forum is a couple months old.  But the new CM doesn't seem to be discouraging those folks in the least bit.....yet.

(allowing other to expose the trolls is not discouraging the behavior)

 

As far as Trancejeremy goes, he's been criticizing Turbine for years.  On issues like difficulty, speed of leveling, and assorted other topics.  I'd be careful when using the adjective rational and his name in the same sentence.   I remember reading one of his posts about his champ being squishy.   At the time I had just rolled a Champ on a new server.  I was taking on 4 to 5 mobs at a time and only losing 50 - 60% health tops.  I then did something daring and read his my lotro blog.   It was like watching pink floyd the wall on 7 hits of high grade acid.  (at no point in time will you understand anything presented)    Very similar to Mrs. ODP he too was offered advice on how to improve, so he could survive longer, and he just squandered that advice.   He isn't there to discuss the game rather play the forum.   I can understand stubbornness but his frustrations with Lotro were always at the point where he was ready to quit over them.  The solution was presented as a main course to him and he simply pushed the plate away.   There's nothing rational about that.  If he is posting that way it's under a rouse or he is simply confused.

Is RKL banned yet?

I have no information on that, that is official.  His posts seemed to end around the same time he was in super troll mode, mid thread.  I haven't really read the forums over there in 2 or 3 months but I notice his name absent from conversations he loved to throw butane at.  The thread I linked above is RKL-less.  This was one of his favorite topics to interject his long green nose into.   I haven't seen him charge the 3 billygoats gruff a toll in quite sometime.  Just a theory though.  I have no scientific proof.

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I don't remember seeing RKL's posts lately. But I used to mostly go around when I saw his name (or other main trolls), so it's possible that I just missed him or skipped his posts and forgot.

 

WHHeydt is long gone, that happened long before Sapience. With him gone, Heydts aren't the same. He was a major douche, he would often sit in suggestions forum and ridicule people. DJ doesn't seem malicious to me, she's just comedy sometimes. 

 

Frikinmuck is much more quiet.

 

Mar-something complained that the new community manager doesn't delete posts she reports, that was sad and funny.

 

That Arnenna person is probably the biggest troll now, I don't know where he/she came from. I don't remember him in the past.

 

This is from Trancejeremy post:

 

 

I think part of the trouble with this game is they made a pretty solid game with SoA. Maybe not spectacular, but pretty good. Then they proceeded to basically change everything in the game from how it worked in SoA. In particular, constantly introducing new systems that mostly introduce nothing but more grind to the game. Essence is just the latest example.

That's one of the troubles with LOTRO - it's not just one grind (as in many Asian MMORPGs), it's probably a half-dozen grinds. Hamster wheel after hamster wheel.

 

It looks like that's his only post since July, so basically he's not a negative part of community at this point, maybe that will change.

 

But the biggest difference is that there's no blue name ridiculing people. I think Turbine has conciously decided to back away from all things Sapience, because one of them even criticized the 10% thinking.

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By the end, I'd come to despise the epic story, too.  They took one of the best parts of the book, for me, and made it just - awful. (Eomer looks like Zap Rowsdower, if anyone knows MST3K - that pains me, 

 

Ok, I was all set to like you, until you had to insult The Man himself:

 

216333-zap-rowsdower.jpg

 

Look at him. Just look. Forget Gandalf. I would follow this man all the way to Mordor. He saved Canada from evil cultists, for pete's sake!! He didn't need no stinking fellowship. Just his friend Troy, a broken pick-up truck, his rifle, and his love of beer. Now THAT's a hero.

 

Welcome to the forum :P

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This (rather innocent) thread is quite amusing.

 

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?555962-A-deleted-scene-from-the-dead-marshes

 

I like the creativity of the OP - simple and straightforward :)

 

 

That's very funny...and true.

 

With the release of 14.2 I noticed there are basically no "faces in the water" in the dead marshes. For me that's a huge disappointment. Would have been so easy to do too. Typical Turbine.

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This (rather innocent) thread is quite amusing.

 

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?555962-A-deleted-scene-from-the-dead-marshes

 

I like the creativity of the OP - simple and straightforward :)

 

I saw that this morning and bookmarked it to see if it would be allowed to continue.  Glad to see that it's still around.

 

I loved the OP and his outstanding response to the person who told him "it was great until the last few lines" (paraphrased).  Seems like some posters over there still think that the only good negativity is the kind that tries to shame others for not liking what Turbine is doing.  

 

Waiting for Mar-imayahoo to come in and get all indignant about the term "maintenance mode".   

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I loved the OP and his outstanding response...

 

This response was simply awesome and one of the rare occasions on the OF for something that smart.

 

The reality is that the smart people can't be OK with the current state of the game and this guy is a good example for this.

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