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Lotro PvPers...are they really that bad?


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Tagging along with the previous comment...

 

Could you list who was the lead dev for creating instances that you may know?  Some of the commentary you've made so far on this doesn't quite jive with what has been implied  and/or expressed on the OF in the past.

 

As though Turbine would ever be anything other than 100% truthful in their marketing- unlike virtually every other company on planet Earth. :)

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It's entirely up to the companies to decide how to interpret the NDA in relation to my comments. If they want to 'come after me', as you put it, they know who I am. I do appreciate your concern on t

Modbreak: Dear GameDev, Please refrain from posting personal information on this board. Given your geolocation, it might be perceived as a rather vengeful thing. Say hi to the rest of Turbine

I agree with this on a personal level. First post here although I consider this forum superior to the official one (where most of my posts over the years were confined to grants on rank x threads)

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All of that is just to underscore that mistakes-including drop rates-are common and more often than not are just honest miscalculations.

Rather then being a contrivence to feed the store I suspect the dev/devs in question either, a, misjudged the number of FAs that their loot tables would put into circulation, or, b, just goofed outright in stacking the loot table. My experience at Turbine leads me, when I am not entirely aware of the reasoning behind a questionable decision, to give the benefit of the doubt insofar as I assume human error is at play. 

thanks for responding to my question.  had the scenario happened once I would have chalked it up to human error/honest miscalculation.  as it has happened consecutively over the past three major updates leads me to believe otherwise.

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thanks for responding to my question.  had the scenario happened once I would have chalked it up to human error/honest miscalculation.  as it has happened consecutively over the past three major updates leads me to believe otherwise.

exactly this.

 

with this specific loot error distribution, the error has been repeated in a way that actually seems more like replicated, several times with newer content additions...

 

a case of fool me once, shame on you.

fool me twice, shame on me.

fool me 3 times...  ON THE CARPET MOTHERFUCKER!  THIS IS INDEED WHAT FIRE UNDER YOUR ASS FEELS LIKE & THAT TIME HAS ARRIVED!

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Saying that the game suck and I quit, doesnt help the devs.

 

It's quite ironic that you see more constructive criticism on this black listed forum (such as the recent auto attacking champ thread) than you do on the OF. We do of course have our fair share of unconstructive criticism but often you will find a more full debate with examples and analysis here, where the malcontents hang out, than you do on the OF.

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Edited: It was an outburst because I feel very strongly about game developer professionalism and don't consider ousting people by name to a community of players to be constructive. I apologize for lacking that professionalism myself in my post.

Edited by GameDev
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Yikes... another QA developer looking back and judging from the glorious position of retrospection. You're absolutely breaking NDA btw (also I have no idea why Zenimax hasn't come after you for those pictures, they must not have seen this yet - what were you thinking? And mentioning sales numbers?). I mean, you can say you aren't breaking NDA, but you can also say the world is flat and still be wrong. And yet despite saying you, in their position, would ban you, you continue on. And only after being there for what, 2 years? You can say nice things to try to balance all the stuff you've said, but at the end of the day you're still being incredibly disrespectful, short-sighted, and in a few cases just wholly incorrect. I mean christ if I was one of the people you'd complimented, I'd ask you to take my name out simply because it was associated with yours.

 

"I'm not going to name names and talk shit, but here's a ton of names, and I'm gonna talk shit"

 

The fault of a lot of QA devs (and I've been in that position) is that they think that, just because they're on the front lines of seeing faults, they believe they could've done anyone else's job better. But that's coming from a place of no accountability for that level of work. I'd bet if you actually worked as a designer, an artist, an engineer - anything that let you see outside of the box you're in - you'd feel quite a bit differently.

And the visibility of this... yikes again. It only takes a second on Google to find *snip* as the name associated with that account. Totally fascinating to read as a player, *snip*, but as a developer I can only cringe.

stereotypical-street-punk-meme-generator

 

& if he isn't one...  this guy is going to spend his entire career polishing turds.

 

a successful game, will never be on his resume, that much is certain.

Edited by MueR
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Oh god the armor. I have no idea why it looked so awful, especially in SoA, or how any art director could look at these designs and say, 'great work, ship it!'. Running around at lower levels I really felt like I was being trolled by the game. You know there's a problem when the cosmetic system-allowing you to cover up your hard-earned gear-was one of the most universally popular systems ever released for LOTRO. In WoW my little mage wore her PvP armor with pride. In LOTRO it was like being forced to wear that awful sweater your aged aunt gave you for Christmas every time you went to school.

 

LOTRO was my first MMO and I didn't have anyone nearby who had ever played one, so I was pure noob for way longer than most.

 

I ran around in that ugly stuff until I got into my first kinship.  They had a kin uniform, so I was introduced to the wonders of the cosmetic system by them and never looked back.

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...I think you meant awesome  :P

 

Boh_Costume.jpg

 

You've got style!

 

That ugly flat "pie pan on the head with ear flaps " helm you got in the man/hobbit starter instance was only a harbinger of the awesomeness to come.  The color combinations alone could make your eyes bleed.

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Transparency earns greater trust than not. This isn't rocket science (but it is psychology, LOL).

...

So it's great that you came along to pull back the curtain for us, even a tiny bit. On one hand, some bitterness might be assuaged when it turns out a mystery we could only speculate about wasn't true (going F2P as survival mode as opposed to greed), and on the other hand, the misgivings of former players who had felt shafted by Turbine over the years may be validated with a sense of closure when other speculations are true. For those of us who left, we wouldn't have gotten this annoyed/pissed if we didn't love the game and community in the first place, after all.

This has been rather cathartic. ;) But it's also pretty clear that in its current state and lack of resources and WB-Turbine's intentions vis-a-vis no marketing presence, Lotro isn't turning around. But it may slowly limp, if WB so deems it.

 

Having worked on a few projects that were left to limp along myself, knowing there were limits to what we could do with the resources given and watching as the new shinys left us in the dustbin of irrelevance, I do feel empathy for the worker-bees of LOTRO.  Edited to add (*)

 

Management, not so much, but for the ones who churn out the content, yeah, that's a tough spot to be in.

 

* mostly (see below)

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Having worked on a few projects that were left to limp along myself, knowing there were limits to what we could do with the resources given and watching as the new shinys left us in the dustbin of irrelevance, I do feel empathy for the worker-bees of LOTRO.

 

Management, not so much, but for the ones who churn out the content, yeah, that's a tough spot to be in.

Definitely. When the multiple layoffs hit Turbine starting shortly after Helm's Debacle, I'm pretty sure all of us here were keenly aware that the people who should have been let go weren't (*cough*Rick Heaton*cough*).

Also, Bohemond, nice outfit. :P I'm of the firm belief that in a game with a cosmetic system, either put together something awesomely coordinated or go all out and clash like a god.

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Yikes... another QA developer looking back and judging from the glorious position of retrospection. You're absolutely breaking NDA btw (also I have no idea why Zenimax hasn't come after you for those pictures, they must not have seen this yet - what were you thinking? And mentioning sales numbers?). I mean, you can say you aren't breaking NDA, but you can also say the world is flat and still be wrong. And yet despite saying you, in their position, would ban you, you continue on. And only after being there for what, 2 years? You can say nice things to try to balance all the stuff you've said, but at the end of the day you're still being incredibly disrespectful, short-sighted, and in a few cases just wholly incorrect. I mean christ if I was one of the people you'd complimented, I'd ask you to take my name out simply because it was associated with yours.

 

"I'm not going to name names and talk shit, but here's a ton of names, and I'm gonna talk shit"

 

The fault of a lot of QA devs (and I've been in that position) is that they think that, just because they're on the front lines of seeing faults, they believe they could've done anyone else's job better. But that's coming from a place of no accountability for that level of work. I'd bet if you actually worked as a designer, an artist, an engineer - anything that let you see outside of the box you're in - you'd feel quite a bit differently.

And the visibility of this... yikes again. It only takes a second on Google to find *snip* as the name associated with that account. Totally fascinating to read as a player, *snip*, but as a developer I can only cringe.

Do you get paid for being an asshole?

 

edit: Seems like I just got the answer for that question right below this post.

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RE: Edited by MueR, Today, 07:36.

my apologies for not editing the name.  i will be more cautious in the future.

 

Unless the poser actually saw (and is not assuming) what the NDA says he has no legs whatsoever - sounds like the normal bitter -" I wanted to be a great dev but QA kept proving my code is shit argument" ;-)

"if I was one of the people you'd complimented, I'd ask you to take my name out simply because it was associated with yours."

 

and literally no one is surprised, his name isn't mentioned.

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Yes. I was thinking of that one person working for Turbine, the grunt sent into a gunfight with a butterknife.

mm....yep.

The thing that always baffled me was the lack of tie-in advertising and activities when the Hobbit movies came out. But I see now it likely wasn't something WB was interested in helping with. We had an IC based around Erebor and that was it. After all the out of place stuff they did like Draigoch and the 'dream sequence' that allowed a Balrog fight in OD, they didn't even whip up a historic, flashback, Smaug fight for us. No commercials on TV to piggyback the Hobbit mania going on. I expected a LOTRO wink during the previews before the Hobbit movies started in theaters.

My understanding was that they did not have license rights to the hobbit book - just the LotR volume

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My understanding was that they did not have license rights to the hobbit book - just the LotR volume

I think what Leafblade was meaning was the lack of advertising or cashing in on The Hobbit movies. Other MMOs had ads in the trailers. Hell WB could have put an ad inside every DVD of The Hobbit, with free TP for new players to try and get them to play the game.

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A quick question based on this comment:

 

Aylwen, was there any other reason --anything at all-- to create an IC in Erebor, aside from conceptual attachment to the coming Hobbit movies?

The art used in those spaces was very obviously copied from previous locations (e.g. Moria), so in theory this IC could have been anywhere (with the same amount of work to create it).

That was a tie-in to the movies.

One interesting thing about the WB acquisition is that one might have expected a greater use of the LOTR film imagery in LOTRO moving forward, certainly in marketing. In fact, at the meeting where the announcement was given, Crowley commented that such could now be expected (along the lines of, 'if we want to put Elijah Wood in there, we can do that now'). This never happened, at least not in a blatant fashion. Which I suppose, while perhaps questionable from the marketing standpoint, was probably for the best insofar as LOTRO at least maintained its artistic identity.

I think what Leafblade was meaning was the lack of advertising or cashing in on The Hobbit movies. Other MMOs had ads in the trailers. Hell WB could have put an ad inside every DVD of The Hobbit, with free TP for new players to try and get them to play the game.

About the closest thing I can think of WB doing in that regard was running LOTRO ads during televised showings of theLOTR trilogy a couple of years ago.

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That was a tie-in to the movies.

One interesting thing about the WB acquisition is that one might have expected a greater use of the LOTR film imagery in LOTRO moving forward, certainly in marketing. In fact, at the meeting where the announcement was given, Crowley commented that such could now be expected (along the lines of, 'if we want to put Elijah Wood in there, we can do that now'). This never happened, at least not in a blatant fashion. Which I suppose, while perhaps questionable from the marketing standpoint, was probably for the best insofar as LOTRO at least maintained its artistic identity.

 

I always wondered if that was due more to maybe WETA and the two main artists owning those visual interpretations - but I did enjoy seeing LOTRO's  different take on how the world might look

 

Except for the overabundance of the swan motif in the Gondor areas.  

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Looks like GameDev is back online.

 

I bet his blunder cost Turbine more subs than Aylwen's openness ever could have.

The people still subbed to Lotro aren't going to be visiting this forum, though. (Well, some do, but I mean those people who believe they should be able to sit AFK in the wilderness and not be killed by anything.)

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"GameDev" is the free player version of the name.  

 

To get the more creative name, you need to get out your credit card.

*rimshot*

;)

 

Hell WB could have put an ad inside every DVD of The Hobbit, with free TP for new players to try and get them to play the game.

 simple, cost effective & targeted.

 

...but, no.  *shrug*

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