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Germanwings flight crash in France


Darmokk
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They are saying only one pilot was in the cockpit and the other one can be heard banging on the door from the outside.

Those doors are now terrorist proof and he didn't get in.

Looks like a bit of a fuckup.

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I don't get it, was the pilot locked in the cockpit trying to kill himself and take the whole plane with him or did the only pilot who knew how to fly the plane lock himself out and a trainee in the cockpit was "on his own" suddenly?

 

Could be one went out to take a piss and the remaining pilot passed out somehow, or perhaps the remaining pilot had just fucked up and was too engrossed in fixing the problem that he couldn't get up to open the door. It seems that the main captain was very experienced whilst the co-pilot was something of a trainee in comparison (although obviously still with hundreds of hours of flight time, as you need for a commercial flight). Although it is impossible to know which one was locked out and which one was still flying the plane.

 

I'm surprised though that the pilots themselves don't have some emergency way to re-enter the cockpit. Or that there aren't rules that if they need to go for a piss they have to ask one of the air stewards to sit in the cockpit so there are at least still two people who could open the door.

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I'm surprised though that the pilots themselves don't have some emergency way to re-enter the cockpit. Or that there aren't rules that if they need to go for a piss they have to ask one of the air stewards to sit in the cockpit so there are at least still two people who could open the door.

 

From reading around on the subject I think it depends on the size of the aircraft as to if 'at least 2' people have to be in the cockpit at any one time. But I believe it is procedure on some aircraft for a member of the cabin crew to come on to the cockpit if one of the pilots has to leave (toilet break). In this case I am unsure of what the procedure was and if it has been followed.

 

The chance of the incident being caused by the lone pilot in the cockpit 'passing out' is almost zero. Firstly, if he had passed out the plane would have remained on autopilot (human control would 100% be required for the descent pattern undertaken). Secondly, if the pilot was unconcious then the 'lock' on the door would 'time out' after 5 minutes. To keep the door locked for longer than 5 minutes would require a concious pilot to keep resetting the lock.

 

Most likely scenario. Plane reaches cruising altitude, one pilot goes to the toilet. Other pilot keeps him locked out and deliberately crashes the plane in to the mountain.  

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I don't get it, was the pilot locked in the cockpit trying to kill himself and take the whole plane with him or did the only pilot who knew how to fly the plane lock himself out and a trainee in the cockpit was "on his own" suddenly?

It was a suicide.

Not for the first time. I think people have been focusing too much on the terrorists from outside the cockpit so far.

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According to French authorities this is exactly what has happened

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-32063587

 

I'm curious to see if the co-pilot suggested to the other pilot that this was a good time to go take a break or not.  It's hard for me to imagine that the idea to fly into the mountain came into his head just as the other guy was gone; you'd think he'd have been planning to do that all along, and it wasn't just a spur-of-the-moment thing.  It's very disturbing in any case and so sad for the families to get that news on top of everything else they're going through now.

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If the suicide hypothesis is true, then this is the wrong thread.

 

Then this should be in the rage thread.

 

If that co-pilot wanted to step out of life, he should have just gotten it over with and hung himself and not take the lives of so many others with him. Too scared to tie a good strong rope around his neck and kick the stool underneath his feet, instead flies 150 people into a mountain wall?

 

There are times you wish there was a God and he or his Servant would be at the gates yonder the Valley of Death and he'd kick all the fucking asshats right to hell.

 

But there is no God. This co-pilot has his peace. And the families and friends of 150 people are left with the shattered lives of their loved ones. Once you realize religion is poison, you find out it can be healing as well. The irony is big and for once actually not funny at all.

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I'm curious to see if the co-pilot suggested to the other pilot that this was a good time to go take a break or not.  It's hard for me to imagine that the idea to fly into the mountain came into his head just as the other guy was gone; you'd think he'd have been planning to do that all along, and it wasn't just a spur-of-the-moment thing.  It's very disturbing in any case and so sad for the families to get that news on top of everything else they're going through now.

I think he spent weeks in Google Earth looking for just the right mountain face to smash the plane into.

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Plane flying along, don't know the altitude, but say an eagle or hawk goes right through the window? It's happened, maybe even a stray meteroite? Dead pilot in cabin, minimal plane damage until the impact with the ground. Reports said the guy went full down on the stick.

Wouldn't they be able to hear the noise on the audio of the wind from the broken windshield? All they heard apparently was the copilot breathing. Also, the pilot should have been able to punch in a code to get in if the copilot was incapacitated. To keep the door locked the copilot would need to relock the door each time, according to reports I've read. Not sure if that's true or not though. If he really killed everyone it's just too horrible. :(

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Plane flying along, don't know the altitude, but say an eagle or hawk goes right through the window? It's happened, maybe even a stray meteroite? Dead pilot in cabin, minimal plane damage until the impact with the ground. Reports said the guy went full down on the stick.

Any number of things could have incapacitated the lone copilot, some of them would leave him breathing.

But that doesn't explain why the door was hard locked in the first place.

And as I said, I thought suicide the moment I looked at the flight path. I mean he just aimed the whole thing straight at that mountain face and went in as hard as it gets.

And that flight path wouldn't result from the lone person in the cockpit being passive. They had that greek(?) plane doing that some time ago (air pressure loss and a flight attendant was trying to fly). The plane went straight and person until fuel ran out.

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I was thinking about the statement that he was "breathing normally" the whole time and how people are trying to connect that with him being incapacitated or unconscious.

 

I had the thought that maybe after he set everything up, he just closed his eyes and shut everything else out and never even knew exactly when the plane was going to hit.

 

Like a psycho kind of zen state, just knowing he was going to die and not caring.

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I was thinking about the statement that he was "breathing normally" the whole time and how people are trying to connect that with him being incapacitated or unconscious.

 

I had the thought that maybe after he set everything up, he just closed his eyes and shut everything else out and never even knew exactly when the plane was going to hit.

 

Like a psycho kind of zen state, just knowing he was going to die and not caring.

Yeah but the rude captain was banging on the door the whole time.

They now say that there has been an altercation with yelling on the outgoing leg of that flight, involving at least the captain in play, according to passengers.

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Makes you kind of worried to fly when you can't even trust the pilots.

Well there is thousand of pilots so simple propalability factor would have to mean that such sort of thing has to happen sooner or later.

 

Besides you cannot worry like that, because you would have to not use any kind of travelling as even if you travel on foot or in your own car then other people travelling near you might want to kill you because of psychical instability or any other reason.

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In his house they found a doctor's note saying he was unfit for duty for the timeframe in question, for psychological reasons.

Oops.

 

Yeah, no surprise there.  

 

Expecting a person who is having issues to be the one to "self-report" and say "oh, btw, the Dr. says I shouldn't be allowed near an aircraft today" - in this case, a person who seems to have wanted to be around planes all his life and already had a shaky past in getting to his goal of being a pilot- needs to be changed immediately.

 

They need a hotline system set up for doctors to say "keep this person away from the planes!"  and make sure they have a system in place to act on it.

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They need a hotline system set up for doctors to say "keep this person away from the planes!"  and make sure they have a system in place to act on it.

In the US, and probably in Germany, psychologists and psychiatrists are required to take action when the patient is likely to turn violent on others or themselves.

I guess nobody has made rules taking the job in question into account.

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Those who are thinking about suicide and comment it the least are generally the most likely to go through with it... food for thought.  That's why all passengers should be allowed to carry a lighter.... shit's going down, I want that last smoke.

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