Jump to content
LOTROCommunity

If they never fix the new problems in Lotro ...


Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, Papi said:

what i find interesting is that the MMO sites haven't picked up and ran a story about the current state of LOTRO.  sure, Massively will act all fanboi like and post that LOTRO was "immortalized" on the TV show Jeopardy (really?) but won't even touch the continuing performance issues of both AC2 and LOTRO--especially since they are directly related.

what we are seeing now isn't just the typical negative speak from disgruntled players.  as others have mentioned, people who never post on the forums have come out of the woodwork to vent their frustrations--even though according to the exec producer and the CM "most of the problems are fixed"

unless of course, the MMO sites have touched on it and i just missed it.  anything is possible :)

Like any quasi media outlet, ratings (or clicks in this case) are the meter.  LOTRO simply does not generate ANY traffic on external sites.  The mmo industry and it's market have moved on.   As a writer you have a choice to write about something that will generate some clicks or something that less the 30 people will even look at.  Post HD when any article written about LOTRO generated comments measured in the 10's and views measured in the100's.  Most sites came to the realization they had better ways to spend time.  That and by nature most gaming writers tend to be optimists.  Unless it's a major news item that affects the industry beyond the game in question, they generally tend to avoid depressing articles.  And with LOTRO it's rather hard to write anything but,  even Massively couldn't keep the spin up.  They were the last who did  reg LOTRO coverage.  Everyone pretty much just copy/pastes Turbines PR/Update releases and stick it somewhere on site and forget about it, if that.  It doesn't generate enough revenue/traffic to the site to put forth more effort.

 

EDIT: these days about the only thing you see about LOTRO on external sites is the music festival with 3-5 posters bumping each other for a week or two then crickets return.  Even this site which is LOTRO centric doesn't generate all that much LOTRO discussion when you get right down to it.  And it's full of the disappointed and the dis-enfranchised, the type of pissed off that likes to vent.

 

DBL EDIT it's quite telling that the only following the game has among a "rabid following" outside the OF is here.  Even Colonial Marines has more organic support and interest.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 207
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

i'm sorry, did I just read that correctly-- " Putting in a ticket directly with your internet company telling them of the issue may help as well."  are they fucking serious?  that is almost as bad as

wow, i mean just...wow: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?599636-why-have-the-updates-to-fix-game-lag-stopped&p=7538109#post7538109 so according to the executive producer, "the issu

Not even close. Turbine has no reason to make any changes if people will continue to play regardless. So we're in agreement. People can continue to moan about the game they refuse to stop playi

Posted Images

14 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

Exactly that.

LotRO died when the external sites stopped caring, as MMOs absolutely need more people looking into them.

That's why it's amusing seeing the forums as they are now, as it's basically been taken over by the circle jerk who will keep proclaiming how awesome LotRO is.

As far as performance goes, don't waste your time with it - LotRO was written for only a single core, and there's very little you can do with that architecture beyond sticking it on an SSD and hoping for the best.  I wouldn't be surprised if you would get better performance out of LotRO sticking it on an XP VM in a modern system, provided the VM you are using allows for direct access to the GPU, so you aren't forced into software rendering everything.

I can attest that LOTRO does indeed run better when hosted on an SSD, but it doesn't fix everything. Loading times are much quicker, but that's about the only improvement you'll notice.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/16/2016 at 4:49 AM, Thrabath said:

till lotro gets an update and the DDO peeps saying Lotro gets more love ;)

The CPU performance thread is an interesting one, i'm going to check if i can change some settings at home to improve playability :)

Linkage?

It isn't a secret what kind of computer works well for LOTRO and other games that are older or low budget and hence not multithreaded. Stop buying computers with many slow cores.  And you absolutely must do your homework and find out what the turbo mode multipliers for a given CPU are, because (if you have sufficient cooling) you will run in turbo mode.

Consumer SATA SSDs are garbage. More RAM is how you speed things up if thingie is noodling around on the disk too much.

 

ETA: my gaming computer is an Ivy bridge 3.4 GHz that goes to 3.8 GHz. Costs next to nothing today. Ivy bridge was substantially better than Sandy Bridge because the turbo mode kicks in quicker.

Link to post
Share on other sites

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?596801-Next-Up-Client-Performance-Issues/page4

I knew a part of this already and when my videocard retired I replaced it by a nvidia 750Ti (I had 2  Ati 5870HD), because that was much better for my electricity bill and I don't game that much anymore.

But I still do have an i7 multicore processor, so some tweaking on that one could probably help increase performance :)

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

Everything I'm reading is pointing to most of the lag coming from what the software is doing.

LotRO needed to have an optimization pass done in RoR, as we shouldn't have had the performance hit when doing mounted combat, at least, compared to the rest of the game.

Basically, what Square tackled with FFXIV and it's rewrite, as seen:

 

A series  of optimization passes would have done wonders even earlier that RoR even as early as U6 significant gains could have been achieved.  However it was NEVER in the cards.  For such passes to be viable the individuals req. fairly in depth knowledge of the engine.  During and after SOM development and launch Turbine had been shifting personnel to DDO and other projects(all of which never even reached alpha so in effect wasted effort for those projects).  Turbine continued to play musical chairs with 2.5 mmo's with barely enough staff to cover 1, while also pursuing pipe dream projects, none of which ever amounted to much.  Then later the by now routine layoff rounds at turbine began.  

    Over time that destroys subject matter expertise beyond a certain level.  You can work on overlay systems but going deeper you will be clueless.  That's simply not possible when at the organizational level polices/practices are being followed that remove subject matter expertise.  By the time U6 hit let alone as late as RoR they no longer had people with requisite knowledge  in positions necessary(the few "old hands" remaining were in supervisory positions, or other projects, not actually in position to do the work, and Turbine moved people around too much and too fast for a decent level of knowledge transfer; in effect loosing that knowledge/expertise)  to pull off a credible opti pass, let alone a series of them.   

 

Any engine in-house or 3rd party requires a fair level of competence/comfort level to navigate/manipulate.  Add to this in house work tends to be relatively poorly documented in most dev houses not just Turbine, when you go out of your way to remove people with "hands on" and/or limit their ability to transfer knowledge, it has an effect over time.  3rd party at least has the benefit of being (relatively) highly documented.

 

EDIT I mean hell even back in ROI they couldn't even manage the MyLotro systems effectively.  And that's an order of magnitude less demanding system & needed core expertise than an opti pass would require.  Or the current "migration shenanigans" certain tasks require more than just a pulse.

 

 

DBLK Edit the FFIV comparison is somewhat unfair as they were in the process of a complete engine rebuild(or building from scratch depending on POV)  That CREATES subject matter expertise by default that translates to optimization capability.  LOTRO hasn't been in that position, capability wise, for at least 5 years.  He also went out of his way to ensure that people coming into the project were appropriately brought up to speed and that existing personnel experience wasn't lost In the shuffle.  Again something LOTRO, if it ever had, didn't have late/post MoM.  If LOTRO/Turbine had had anything remotely like the discipline in management of resources Reborn/SQ represented it would be in less dire need of optimization(among other things) at this late date.  You simply can't squeeze blood from a stone.  If the expertise isn't there, it isn't there.

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, cossieuk said:

Getting the game to use DirectX 12 would be a good idea if it is possible.

I laugh, the only new hires they are getting are Mobile centric.  I wouldn't hold my breath. They could make you a nice Facebook app however in a couple years(about the time the market has become fully saturated...history repeats itself).  All things considered Turbine is a fascinating company to watch for entertainment value well above it's games. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Multithreading (to use multiple CPUs/cores) is not going to happen, and people urgently need to stop asking for it.

Worst case Turbine attempts it and you get an unstable game from the attempt. That can happen, multithreading existing code rates very highly on employee reviews.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Darmokk said:

Multithreading (to use multiple CPUs/cores) is not going to happen, and people urgently need to stop asking for it.

Worst case Turbine attempts it and you get an unstable game from the attempt. 

Turbine would never attempt this. I expect them to have given up on a lot in this game. I even think they have given up on trying to fix the new issues, and have adopted a policy to just say as little as long as possible (Vyvanne and Freelorn). What happened was about as bad as you could expect: major new issues from the server upgrades that they are not able to fix at all, and giving up on the idea of having EU servers. Even I am surprised how bad things are and how the new data center only made the game worse.

Link to post
Share on other sites

In my opinion, nothing will be done to fix LOTRO's problems, unless it is a game breaking bug. They intend to ride out the string, put out maybe a few more updates that take us to Mordor, and then shut it down at the end of 2017, when the license expires. That's it. At this point, why would Turbine invest significant resources into fixing issues with the game, let alone modernizing it, when it has less than two years before it is defunct and shut down?

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, The MMO Troll said:

In my opinion, nothing will be done to fix LOTRO's problems, unless it is a game breaking bug. 

the fact that they've adopted the "the majority of problems have been fixed" rhetoric (despite the evidence to the contrary) backs up your assertion.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 15.2.2016 at 2:01 AM, Urwendil said:

They finally deleted that shit. As I said a few hours ago to my fellow kin co-leader in PM, if there's any administration on Middle-earth more awful than Turbine, it's my university, an that's saying a lot if you knew it :P

There is a new funny thread where someone is is namecalling and blaming another user for always acting like a butt-munch, i wonder how long it will take them to close or delete this. It's already there for 24+ hours :P

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?600532-The_Jagganath-is-a-low-life-scum

Link to post
Share on other sites

Only a small percentage of the LOTRO player base actually use personal computer technologies to play LOTRO.

They do, however, constitute a higher percentage of forum posters.

This small percentage of players therefore constitutes a vocal... umm... non-majority of the active LOTRO player base.

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, The MMO Troll said:

In my opinion, nothing will be done to fix LOTRO's problems, unless it is a game breaking bug. They intend to ride out the string, put out maybe a few more updates that take us to Mordor, and then shut it down at the end of 2017, when the license expires. That's it. At this point, why would Turbine invest significant resources into fixing issues with the game, let alone modernizing it, when it has less than two years before it is defunct and shut down?

At this stage, I doubt they will let the licence expire. They've plateaued with logins, their few remaining paying customers have more money than sense, and they have to do barely anything to keep them around. It's literally a preserved corpse and, at this point, there's probably no need to ever shut it down.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, but they are still spending money on the game for development staff.  

Maybe what we are seeing now is the transition to maintenance mode - including moving the servers to cheaper ones that are managed off site for less.

They must be losing players now. If they lose too many, it will not be worth it, and Turbine will shut down the game if it is losing money.

Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, nosam9 said:

Turbine would never attempt this. I expect them to have given up on a lot in this game. I even think they have given up on trying to fix the new issues, and have adopted a policy to just say as little as long as possible (Vyvanne and Freelorn). What happened was about as bad as you could expect: major new issues from the server upgrades that they are not able to fix at all, and giving up on the idea of having EU servers. Even I am surprised how bad things are and how the new data center only made the game worse.

 

Errr...

We have seen multiple times that lots of software engineering was dumped into dumb projects for LOTRO. Many of them were obviously of the kind that would look good on a resume or employee review self-ass-essment.  In fact a majority of software engineering hours other than the 64 bit for the server software can be placed in this category.

The only thing we have going for us is that Kate Paiz has ordered all of that nonsense and she's gone.

Actually, the 64 bit port of the server software could be in that category, too. Probably useless unless they actually ran out of virtual address space. And looks good on a resume

 

5 hours ago, Doro said:

At this stage, I doubt they will let the licence expire. They've plateaued with logins, their few remaining paying customers have more money than sense, and they have to do barely anything to keep them around. It's literally a preserved corpse and, at this point, there's probably no need to ever shut it down.

Who knows how many of those players actually pay money?

I played a bit lately. Didn't pay a cent.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Darmokk said:

Who knows how many of those players actually pay money?

 

6 hours ago, Doro said:

... their few remaining paying customers have more money than sense...

100% of them, obviously. Otherwise they wouldn't be paying customers.

Link to post
Share on other sites

i found this post interesting (Bango used to post in this forum, no?) https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?597108-Player-Council&p=7542313#post7542313  specifically his last statement.

i'm curious as to what Bango--and folks like him--are actually waiting around for?  the game is over 8 years old.  the data center/hardware move has been a disaster (not to mention they decided to reveal there was no EU move until the last minute) so signs that turbine is turning things around for the better are non-existent.

do they think that turbine will suddenly have an epiphany and spend resources (they claim not to have) to undo all their past mistakes this late in the game's development?  he says he's an idealist but lets call it what it really is--denial.  this goes back to what others have said on this forum many times over, people want to play in middle earth so bad and/or they feel nostalgic about how the game used to be...they are willing to hang on and accept whatever scraps turbine throws at them.

you can voice your displeasure or complain all day long on the OF, but if you are still playing the game, still have a sub, or buying stuff in the store then you are part of the problem.  best thing i ever did was cancel my sub and uninstall the game.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/19/2016 at 5:14 AM, ibfe77 said:

There is a new funny thread where someone is is namecalling and blaming another user for always acting like a butt-munch, i wonder how long it will take them to close or delete this. It's already there for 24+ hours :P

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?600532-The_Jagganath-is-a-low-life-scum

Bango actually got an opportunity to use the David Mitchell "couldn't care less" video in that topic.  Good on you, Bango.

On 2/19/2016 at 7:53 AM, Doro said:

At this stage, I doubt they will let the licence expire. They've plateaued with logins, their few remaining paying customers have more money than sense, and they have to do barely anything to keep them around. It's literally a preserved corpse and, at this point, there's probably no need to ever shut it down.

The only way that the license will be in any danger is if Middle-earth Enterprises gets the impression that the value of the license is being de-valued.  Since they are only interested in profit from the license, that would be a prime motivator for them to coerce Turbine to either make a change or surrender the license.

Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Papi said:

i found this post interesting (Bango used to post in this forum, no?) https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?597108-Player-Council&p=7542313#post7542313  specifically his last statement.

i'm curious as to what Bango--and folks like him--are actually waiting around for?  the game is over 8 years old.  the data center/hardware move has been a disaster (not to mention they decided to reveal there was no EU move until the last minute) so signs that turbine is turning things around for the better are non-existent.

do they think that turbine will suddenly have an epiphany and spend resources (they claim not to have) to undo all their past mistakes this late in the game's development?  he says he's an idealist but lets call it what it really is--denial.  this goes back to what others have said on this forum many times over, people want to play in middle earth so bad and/or they feel nostalgic about how the game used to be...they are willing to hang on and accept whatever scraps turbine throws at them.

you can voice your displeasure or complain all day long on the OF, but if you are still playing the game, still have a sub, or buying stuff in the store then you are part of the problem.  best thing i ever did was cancel my sub and uninstall the game.

I asked Bango that very question about a year ago, seems he is still waiting for that change to happen.

I believe I saw a post of his on the OF recently where he said he wished that turbine would start making content again like Osgilliath and that open world group thing near Dol Amroth.

Now I did that dol Amroth thing before I left around dead marshes time and I am saddened to hear someone say that is what they wish they could return to.

But your right, people like Bango are just as big a problem as the "I'll always play no matter what they do" brigade, in fact worse, at least they admit it, people like Bango will do exactly the same but slate others for being open and honest about doing it.What are they waiting for? What do they expect the constant posting to achieve? Do they think that once they hit a certain number of posts turbine will change their ways?

The time has come to stop acting like the players are the ones calling the shots anymore, they are turbines little bitches who come running whenever they click their fingers, you will always do what they say and accept whatever they do and no amount of posturing on the OF will hide that. If they really want to make a change, get off your knees, take their nuts out if your mouths and drop them completely, either they will FINALLY listen to you or the game will go bust, frankly either way is a win. 

I almost got sucked back in recently, came to see about the new raid and hardware upgrade and EU move.

saw the EU thing was a sham and the hardware thing was a disaster and bailed out, pretty sure that new raid is bollocks as well, won't see that at all.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bell curve.

2000px-Standard_deviation_diagram.svg.pn

The people who are sticking with their invisioned or communicated opinion and will not change it in the face of facts is one.  The big mass in the middle does it a little bit and then moves on.

The curve never goes to actual Bango^H^Hzero. It only approximates. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bobbylobs said:

The time has come to stop acting like the players are the ones calling the shots anymore, they are turbines little bitches who come running whenever they click their fingers, you will always do what they say and accept whatever they do and no amount of posturing on the OF will hide that. If they really want to make a change, get off your knees, take their nuts out if your mouths and drop them completely, either they will FINALLY listen to you or the game will go bust, frankly either way is a win. 

 

 

 

 

this^^  there was a post not too long ago where people were thanking Turbine for adding a mithril coin option to the insidious Minas Tirith side quests (go fetch this, back and forth back and forth)...as if the act of providing a store bought option to alleviate the tediousness of a quest that Turbine created in the first place was somehow worthy of a thanks??  more like a "go fuck yourself!"  people actually were using the logic, "well, at least we have a fast travel option to make the questing bearable"...instead of holding Turbine to task for creating the bloody stupid quests in the first place.  when it gets to that point, there is no point in posting on that type of forum anymore.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Papi said:

this^^  there was a post not too long ago where people were thanking Turbine for adding a mithril coin option to the insidious Minas Tirith side quests (go fetch this, back and forth back and forth)...as if the act of providing a store bought option to alleviate the tediousness of a quest that Turbine created in the first place was somehow worthy of a thanks??  more like a "go fuck yourself!"  people actually were using the logic, "well, at least we have a fast travel option to make the questing bearable"...instead of holding Turbine to task for creating the bloody stupid quests in the first place.  when it gets to that point, there is no point in posting on that type of forum anymore.

 

I've said this before but if you eat shit long enough you acquire a taste for it.  When I see a thank you post I ask "are you shitting me?"  I guess it's like thanking your cell mate for using lube before he rapes you.  They take what they can get at this point.

  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, Papi said:

i found this post interesting (Bango used to post in this forum, no?) https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?597108-Player-Council&p=7542313#post7542313  specifically his last statement.

i'm curious as to what Bango--and folks like him--are actually waiting around for?  the game is over 8 years old.  the data center/hardware move has been a disaster (not to mention they decided to reveal there was no EU move until the last minute) so signs that turbine is turning things around for the better are non-existent.

do they think that turbine will suddenly have an epiphany and spend resources (they claim not to have) to undo all their past mistakes this late in the game's development?  he says he's an idealist but lets call it what it really is--denial.  this goes back to what others have said on this forum many times over, people want to play in middle earth so bad and/or they feel nostalgic about how the game used to be...they are willing to hang on and accept whatever scraps turbine throws at them.

you can voice your displeasure or complain all day long on the OF, but if you are still playing the game, still have a sub, or buying stuff in the store then you are part of the problem.  best thing i ever did was cancel my sub and uninstall the game.

It's quite simple - I have a certain amount of emotional attachment to the game as a result of 9 years of playing it. I know that Turbine are shit (see my reference to Turbine as the MMO equivalent of Viz's Eight Ace) and probably won't change but I won't stop posting for them to do the right thing.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...