Jump to content
LOTROCommunity

Hello from Cordovan


Cordovan
 Share

Recommended Posts

Sapience and his bans are on topic in this thread. Brodrick, Darmokk, Warspeech, Jedi and Doro all brought him up before me. He was pretty damaging to the community and the game.

Sapience used to post that players only got banned for extreme language and breaking the rules of the forum, which obviously wasn't true. Hopefully Cordovan will realize that a lot of players were banned unfairly, because Sapience was trying to control what players said about the game - by giving permabans to players who were critical of Turbine or how the game was changing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, nosam9 said:

Sapience and his bans are on topic in this thread. Brodrick, Darmokk, Warspeech, Jedi and Doro all brought him up before me. He was pretty damaging to the community and the game.

Sapience used to post that players only got banned for extreme language and breaking the rules of the forum, which obviously wasn't true. Hopefully Cordovan will realize that a lot of players were banned unfairly, because Sapience was trying to control what players said about the game - by giving permabans to players who were critical of Turbine or how the game was changing.

take a look at their posts again, he's mentioned in one line, referencing the bans and then folks move on to helpful suggestions (which was the intent of the OP coming here in the first place).  your post is all "Sapience hated me" for this that and the other.  can you step back a second and see that?  I don't think the new CM cares about how you personally felt about Sapience...or how you think he may have felt about you (it gets a bit silly, you see that right?)  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, warspeech said:

I did see that, but thought it was important to highlight the fact that the reason I stopped playing recently isn't because of anything that goes on in the official forums.  

The reason I stopped playing is because the game is a laggy, buggy, crash-prone mess.

If you want to manage a community and make an unprecedented effort to reach out to *everyone* in the community, you deserve to know that game performance is one of the major reasons that your community is shrinking, not anything you may or may not be able to do as far as forum behavior goes.

Cordovan, apologies for getting off your main topic, please understand that it's because I care about the game as much as anyone, it was a big part of my life for a long time and I'd love to be able to see the thing through to the end.

This ^.  As important and valid as changes to Turbines CM efforts would be; most of us who have departed LOTRO did not do so over CM issues.  CM may(or may not) have gotten us out the door quicker, but in the end playing games is about game play.  RH gets a lot of blame here for losing LOTRO's market share particularly post HD beta.  And I certainly won't deny his efforts exacerbated it.  However,  he could have been 100% ethical, 100% honest, 100% transparent, and 100% professional, and HD would still have tanked.  Good.bad CM can help/hurt sure, but it will never trump actual game play.  RH could have been 10x the asshat people believe him to be and if HD had been a good product it would have barely registered.   Good games can and do survive bad CM,  The 2nd coming in the form of CM won't save a bad game.

 

LOTRO's issues will not be fixed by slapping a "new" sticker on it.  CM is the least of it's faults(even when CM was at it's proverbial worst).  Very few people here will say Free was a bad CM, and yet the game continued to shrink in both market share and general gamer awareness despite any efforts on Free's part.  That's not a CM or marketing issue, that's a product delivering what the market will buy issue.  Very few MMORPGers are unaware of LOTRO,  they have a fair grasp of what it offers.  That's why they aren't playing it.

 

EDIT Oh and welcome aboard.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, nosam9 said:

I was banned for simply saying Turbine was not spending much money on Lotro, and was in fact spending as little as possible on the game, while hyping up things like mounted combat and big battles. Eventually it became clear that money was being spent on Infinite Crisis instead of Lotro. But Sapience hated me for speaking out. This was when he was deleting intelligent, well-written posts and threads that were critical of Turbine, back when the forums were very busy. Anything thread that was critical and getting a lot of agreement was removed by him. 

So it was actually Heaton's Law that got us banned. He also at one point was clearly reading this forum and worked to ban people who were posting here. I made a second account over there, and when it was clear who I was, Sapience quickly banned my Lotro forum account for what I was saying over here. He did not know this was a second forum account, but he hated what I said here, which was critical of him and Turbine.

One good thing about Sapience though was his ability to gather feedback from players and bring it to the developers.

As someone said above, it's true; I am not particularly concerned with how you feel/felt about previous people in this position. I do plan to make an effort to take another look at bans, generally on an on-request basis through our support system, when time permits. As said, it'll be a few weeks before I have time to do this, though.

Regarding the claim that you say got you banned: Not looking at the validity of the moderation decision, but just saying that your statement is simply not accurate. LOTRO and Infinite Crisis had separate budgets, and LOTRO's budget was not set by spending on Infinite Crisis (at least I've never heard of it happening.) That's not how we manage our games. Without providing more detail than permitted, the games in general set their budgets by their own revenue, which is part of the reason they have been able to be sustained for as long as they have. There may be additional investment from other sources, but the idea that we'd cut one budget to give it to another game is simply not what happens.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is another thing about the "don't be a dick" meta-rule.

The pro-game trolls on the OF were every bit as bad as the anti-game trolls and anti-game non-trolls.  But the former could just do it with immunity, while responding even remotely like they spoke would get anybody but Sapience's lapdogs a ban.  The effect of successfully baiting somebody into saying something bannable was also in full swing - again one-sidedly. 

Not that a ban took breaking an actual rule under Sapience's leadership.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fredelas' ban was the jaw dropping and ridiculously offensive one for me (pretty much as jaw dropping as seeing you post in here).  I would seriously ask you review his ban given how much he gave to the community on the forums (his hytbold guide https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?482751-Hytbold-A-Guide-to-Rebuilding-and-Armour was of immense value to so very many players at the time).

If I have to somehow make a request through the support system to get this rolling I will (as I never actually got banned myself on the forums).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, JRonnie said:

Fredelas' ban was the jaw dropping and ridiculously offensive one for me (pretty much as jaw dropping as seeing you post in here).  I would seriously ask you review his ban given how much he gave to the community on the forums (his hytbold guide https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?482751-Hytbold-A-Guide-to-Rebuilding-and-Armour was of immense value to so very many players at the time).

If I have to somehow make a request through the support system to get this rolling I will (as I never actually got banned myself on the forums).

Tbh the Fred ban did have one "arguably" positive side effect.  Gaming sites started writing non-layoff related articles about LOTRO again, for a little while at least.  When you get low enough even bad press is still press.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, JRonnie said:

Fredelas' ban was the jaw dropping and ridiculously offensive one for me (pretty much as jaw dropping as seeing you post in here).  I would seriously ask you review his ban given how much he gave to the community on the forums (his hytbold guide https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?482751-Hytbold-A-Guide-to-Rebuilding-and-Armour was of immense value to so very many players at the time).

If I have to somehow make a request through the support system to get this rolling I will (as I never actually got banned myself on the forums).

That's kind of you to say, but I've made peace with my absence from the official forums. I'm proud that the Hytbold guide I helped write has been viewed almost 1.3 million times over the last 3 years, and part of me is itching to update it with the changes that have been made in LOTRO since then. But with two foster kids now, I have very little time to actually play the game, let alone contribute to the official forums. If I ever do want to go back, I know where to contact support.

3 hours ago, Bendin said:

Tbh the Fred ban did have one "arguably" positive side effect.  Gaming sites started writing non-layoff related articles about LOTRO again, for a little while at least.  When you get low enough even bad press is still press.

In fairness, I don't think those articles were primarily about me being banned from the official forums. They were about Turbine's community team publicly blaming an unpopular change the developers made in LOTRO on a suggestion I made in the private closed beta forums. In fact, Turbine only implemented a very small part of my suggestion (the unpopular part) and didn't even mention the rest, giving players the impression that I was somehow responsible for their unhappiness. A small number of gaming sites picked up on this (even before I did), and reported some mildly unfavorable things about Turbine as a result.

I do still get a kick whenever I see someone say "Blame Fredelas!" in chat, though. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am glad we get the opportunity to speak our minds, Cordovan. Kudos for starting this thread.

This will not be a short list though.

My young-adult daughter and I have been playing Lotro for almost 6 years now. The not knowing whether the game will continue after 2017 affects our enjoyment of playing. If there is no game after 2017 then we rather know it now than later. I've tried quite a few others, but always come back and am no longer looking at other games.

At the same time, as others have stated above, I too have to write something about development, because it ties in with (as we perceive it) that the game may come to an end sooner than later: e.g. there was no updated jewelry/guilded gear for 105 and that all we can craft is slotted armor. These lacks of new content take away goal setting as well. This gives less incentive to level up crafting, and the spread out updates (instead of a complete expac) gives a bad taste in our mouths. This all gives the feeling that what has happened in the past (Paiz, sorry, have to bring it up) still reverberates in what we see appear today. To me, those things are intrinsically linked with how I experience the forums. These are the foundation beneath the topics that are still debated, and this is what bothers me most: that how the players are treated, through how the game develops, is all part of marketing (to make more $, and the psychology that is used to do it), and is not done to make the game great. And that's where it hurts, seriously. So in my eyes, that's what affects the community most. The marketing speech, the corporate speech, the silences, the lies, the empty promises, 'it can't be done' and now we see it can (housing hooks, cosmetic weapons), the not listening to what players are asking for. The huge number of kin folk that quit playing. Today I saw a kin name in game that I hadn't seen in ages. It's just sad.

And what I just don't get is that it seems that all the above doesn't matter to up high. I am sure it matters to the folks who design the game. They probably have no input. I even wonder whether we see some positive additions that are made by devs in their spare time. I will tell you that I am enjoying those things either way. Cause the game itself, the environment, is awesome. The night skies, the rain, the northern lights, the variety in landscapes, the recognizable places, the story lines. And then I think 'if the game will end, then all those videos, guides, blogs, and screen shots will still be there, and then I can still enjoy those and remember. Silly right, because it's 'just a game'. And at the same time, it's so much more. Look at Weatherstock today. But underneath all that, I despise what I have seen happen over the years.

I too got banned from the OF. It was when players were responding to armour being introduced to the store. I wrote 'the magic is gone' and got banned. Remember, the store was only going to carry items for convenience, not for advantage (that official post was purged).

I believe that when games are made as 'an end', for the sake of the game, the excitement, the beauty, the possibilities, people will bite and buy. That gives a strong player base and a strong community. A game that is a means to an end ($), which is what I see that Lotro has become, is not that. That was also not what Tolkien wrote about, rather, the opposite. And that's why what has happened to the game is so wrong.

So we play with longing for our friends who are gone, and for those things in game that never were, and for a certainty that may never become reality. 

Not a nice message, right? Well, consider this: there is a Paiz video out there somewhere, from a conference on how to make money from gaming. And the statement is made: it doesn't matter what you give the players, they will continue playing and paying (freely recalled from my memory). That may be true, but many players continue playing Lotro despite what they are given, because of Tolkien and his magic - that's a very different logic. So the game may give revenue, but it pushed loyal players and community builders away. Players who expressed to their kin members and also in forum posts how they were giving up, because they couldn't stand it anymore. Quite a few you see here, on this site. Many others have just gone away and rebuilt their communities elsewhere. To me, this is a sign of short term revenue thinking, instead of thinking for the long haul (and it enforces that people think the game will disappear sometime in 2017, and so does the discontinuation of telephone support, the repeated lay offs, the disappearing forum names of long term devs).

How you are going to improve the community, I have no idea. I know that I take everything I see and read with 1000 grains of salt. Everything in game that is changed so that it will now include items that can be purchased for mithril coins, I question. Same with slotted armor, essences, ridiculous legendary grind (need for scrolls), and some of the nicest fluff and decorative additions to the game only available in the store.

I took some screenies of the party tree today, because, you know, we don't know whether the summer festival will be back next year.

In my opinion, the community can only improve when all the above is addressed. A new foundation is needed to build a different kind of house. Best of luck.

Edit Sunday morning:

After sleeping and pondering and stumbling on this thread: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?645020-Are-we-getting-level-105-Guild-crafted-armor-and-jewelry-Anytime (which seriously convinces me that the crafting/guild process of leveling was sacrificed in order to add more/huge grind for essences/armor/jewelry/legendary weapons (money makers) - even though there are many many players who enjoy crafting, gathering, self-sufficiency, and helping out friends - so the decision is made that, maybe, new crafting will arrive in U19 - when people no longer need/want new crafted gear because they are all grinded out by then and have spent their $), I want to add this:

The idea 'working in the Lotro community in the coming weeks' is a disingenious proposal because it seems to rest on the idea that long time players have to forget the past. With other words, long term players have to deny what they saw and see and newer players have to accept the premise that the game as pleasant at this moment, including all the grind and the imcomplete crafting tiers - both long term and newer players have to lie to themselves in order to make sense of and accept the state of the game. And that's not going to happen because we are daily reminded of the problems/deficiencies in game (development), lag included. That you want to do it, probably on orders from up high, is understandable (not laudable) and you may be able to make some progress with folks who were not here yet. However, they all are impacted by the course of the game. You can't repair that with 'working in the community'.

The book keepers behind Lotro may disagree with me, because maybe numbers are better than I think they are, but then, why didn't we get the promised Amsterdam data center, why the world mergers?

  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 7/21/2016 at 4:47 PM, Cordovan said:

Hello! I wanted to create an account here just to introduce myself, and see what's going on. I know there's been some animosity between the community folks and this forum in the past, but AFAIK it didn't involve me (much?), so I figure this new era of sorts is a good time to say hello. I'm the current Community Manager for LOTRO and DDO (and to the extent AC is still supported, Asheron's Call.) I'm an old-school gamer and pen and paper nerd. Ask me about my THACO! 

There's a lot of work to do in the LOTRO community in the coming weeks, and I plan to do it. If you have a short bullet-list of what you feel is most important for the community (not development, that's a different thing), lemme know.

I'm posting this as someone who had played since launch (good old Codemasters) and who has, two weeks ago, finally given up with the game. I've had enough wasting my time (and making excuses to myself) on an MMO that is now so below par as to be beyond parody. Over 9 and a bit years of playing LOTRO and I'm not at all sorry I've walked away. I should have done so when U17 dropped but I managed to convince myself that it was just a blip. U18 told me otherwise.

Anyhow... the Community. Turbine needs to start being honest with its players. Get rid of all the bullshit stuff such as the player councils, special treatment of forum favourites e.g. the crap between Sapience and the LMB kin and go back to first principles of having frequent and open communication with the entire player base. If the likes of Funcom can put out regular comms as to what is happening with their games then there's no reason whatsoever why you can't. It's more than apparent that a culture of not-giving-a-shit as been prevalent at Turbine (at least in the lotro team) for years and whilst your colleagues may be happy with doing the absolute bare minimum necessary, your customer's deserve more.

Lastly, and if you've got a spare few minutes I suggest you read this, and in particular the email "conversation" I had with your ex-colleague R. Heaton. It will tell you everything that was wrong about the "management" of the community back then and why things are as they are now on the official forum.

And on that note I'm done with the whole lotro thing. I would wish you good luck, but I suspect that you're going to need a lot more than that in the coming months.

 

 

Edited by Bango
Couple of small typos.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm curious if turbines policy of only active players being allowed to post is common.  I just verified that I can't post there and never received a ban message, so I assume it's due to inactivity.  The guidelines on the forum are pretty huge and seem designed to reduce criticism.

 

Sapience was easily the worst CM I've ever witnessed though, and even Celestrata was forced to follow his lead after a while.  That really bummed me out.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, frodofraggins said:

I'm curious if turbines policy of only active players being allowed to post is common.  I just verified that I can't post there and never received a ban message, so I assume it's due to inactivity.  The guidelines on the forum are pretty huge and seem designed to reduce criticism.

 

Sapience was easily the worst CM I've ever witnessed though, and even Celestrata was forced to follow his lead after a while.  That really bummed me out.

 

 

Turbine isn't the only studio to have a limitation on active players on the forums. Typically this is done to prevent people from using the forum as a place to troll after they're done playing a game, and helps discourage the fairly large number of people who claim to quit but actually don't (not criticizing, just saying it happens pretty frequently.) It also is used to stop people who might come to the LOTRO forums from other games to troll or cause havoc; less of an issue with LOTRO, but for example on DDO we wouldn't want the DDO community to bombard Neverwinter, and I am sure they don't want their players starting wars on our forums either. While technically a company doesn't need a formal reason to remove someone from the forums, and most of this can be covered by other rules, having a "should be an active player to post" gives moderators headroom to remove people who come onto the forums to cause problems. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cordovan,

I believe you were active on the LOTRO forums during Rick Heaton's time as CM, so you must have some first-hand experience of the troubled times. If you believe Rick Heaton was a great guy and did a great job as CM, nevermind, read no further.

Now since you made the effort to post over here where you were aware of some animosity, you must have an open mind about our opinions on the community.

Rick Heaton was rude, hypocritical, and damaging to the community. Yeah, my opinion, no need to address, but this is important moving forward because that is how not to develop and manage the community. There is the saying " if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all". Frelorn chose not to make snide comments when enforcing, he kept it simple. Some might call it detached and not personal, but that is better than Rick Heaton's method.

-If you have to enforce or discipline, keep it simple, not personal. I actually liked your approach recently in a thread saying basically "quit fighting, or this thread is gonna close".

-Free Fredelas.

-LOTRO team gives us very little information, with mostly crickets during times of uncertainty. This encourages negative speculation, and the little pieces of information we get are so small, they are picked apart for meaning. Often times we are rewarded with the truth when we scrutinize that Turbine said data center instead of data centers. I understand if the news is not good, you don't say anything, you just have to expect the negative speculation. BUT, if you have any positive information to address the speculation, OMG tell us already! Say it specifically, and maybe not buried in a comment on a random thread on page 23. When it comes to the license renewal, in the past, we got vague comments of "we have plans" and "we have agreements". And when we asked for direct answers, we got "gosh guys I already told you". Paraphrasing.

-Amnesty or second chance for those banned during Rick Heaton's time.

-Frequent communications. Even if its just little updates or a screenshot from something down the road.

-Free Fredelas. I think he was banned for calling out Rick Heaton being rude in a thread, when Heaton was actually wrong. I called Rick Heaton out for being rude as well, received infraction. Fredelas did so much for Turbine with his Hytbold guide, may have kept some subscriptions going. Too late now but imagine if Fredelas did a guide for Big Battles, or any other new systems. (sorry Fredelas, I know you don't like this kind of attention, but your ban was a turning point for me).

Thanks for your time Cordovan.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to add that the "Hytbold: A Guide to Rebuilding and Armour" from Fredelas was probably the best and most useful guide for LOTRO that all my kin and myself used for months and I was totally taken aback when I learnt he had be banned for nothing....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 21.7.2016 at 5:47 PM, Cordovan said:

If you have a short bullet-list of what you feel is most important for the community (not development, that's a different thing), lemme know.

Well, hey there.

Short bullet list? Aye.

  • Be honest with what is left of your precious community.
  • Be forward with what you tell them, don't try to hide it behind weasel-wording. They have a habit of finding out, anyway, and it WILL bite your collective behinds. You say that is against Company Policy? You might want to take a look at where said policy got you.
  • Get rid of the threat that is the obnoxious banner mentioning welcoming place and something or other (it's not, in any stretch of the imagination).
  • Use your set of rules consistently.
  • Don't marginalize parts of those that still care of what your company has left of a once great game.

HTH,

SNy

7 hours ago, frodofraggins said:

The guidelines on the forum are pretty huge and seem designed to reduce criticism.

In case you mean the obnoxious banner I mentioned in the post above, I had made further adjustments to my Stylish theme for the LotRO forum (link in sig), which happens to have a setting to tone it down (yes, I could've hidden it, but I expected the text to change for the worse and I meant to take note).

Oh, I just realized that I did not, in fact upload that.

Try this:

#notices .restore {
	background: #161616              !important;
	border: none                     !important;
	color: #909090                   !important;
}

HTH,

SNy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, SNy said:

Well, hey there.

Short bullet list? Aye.

  • Be honest with what is left of your precious community.
  • Be forward with what you tell them, don't try to hide it behind weasel-wording. They have a habit of finding out, anyway, and it WILL bite your collective behinds. You say that is against Company Policy? You might want to take a look at where said policy got you.
  • Get rid of the threat that is the obnoxious banner mentioning welcoming place and something or other (it's not, in any stretch of the imagination).
  • Use your set of rules consistently.
  • Don't marginalize parts of those that still care of what your company has left of a once great game.

HTH,

SNy

In case you mean the obnoxious banner I mentioned in the post above, I had made further adjustments to my Stylish theme for the LotRO forum (link in sig), which happens to have a setting to tone it down (yes, I could've hidden it, but I expected the text to change for the worse and I meant to take note).

Oh, I just realized that I did not, in fact upload that.

Try this:


#notices .restore {
	background: #161616              !important;
	border: none                     !important;
	color: #909090                   !important;
}

HTH,

SNy

Are you talking about the link to the Community Guidelines? My understanding is you can simply X it out and it won't show up again, provided you are logged in. Unsure what's so obnoxious about it, seems pretty benign to me: " We strive to make these forums a welcoming, open, respectful, place for discussion about LOTRO. As part of this effort, our community team has created and enforces a set of Community Guidelines that all members are expected to follow. If you haven't read them, or if it's been a while, please take a moment to do so. "

It'd be pretty easy to get rid of it, although I'm not sure where else the rules are linked to on the forums, which is why I think it's there to begin with.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It appears you are unaware of the timing and... atmosphere... that spawned this thing and the threat implied by it (bonus points for the screaming colors).

Also, there's a thing or two about the way you guys handle the forum logins, which makes this

simply X it out and it won't show up again, provided you are logged in

a non-working suggestion 99% of the time, at least for me.

SNy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, SNy said:

It appears you are unaware of the timing and... atmosphere... that spawned this thing and the threat implied by it (bonus points for the screaming colors).

Also, there's a thing or two about the way you guys handle the forum logins, which makes this

 

 

a non-working suggestion 99% of the time, at least for me.

SNy

Timing and atmosphere isn't a big concern of mine at this point, although I suppose history can color your reaction to it for sure. What - today - prevents you from being logged in and Xing out of it? I am not aware of a persistent logout issue, and have not experienced it in several years. What - today - makes you believe that it is a current "threat"? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Cordovan said:

What - today - prevents you from being logged in and Xing out of it? I am not aware of a persistent logout issue, and have not experienced it in several years.

I have no idea what prevents it. I am, however, consistently not-logged-in the day after I was. I suppose it could be my use of the HTTPS Everywhere plugin (which I only installed because of the way your earlier team handled logins), but I won't go out of my way to find the cause.

15 minutes ago, Cordovan said:

What - today - makes you believe that it is a current "threat"? 

As for the history, look up "welcoming place" in a certain dictionary. And maybe "open and respectful discussion".

As for today? Dunno, I guess I feel that the wording of the "at will" parts, applied with the usual consistency, implies a threat. That might be unjustified today, but wrt. to trust, I refer to section "CM", 3rd paragraph, easily lost, hard to earn and all that.

If you feel I am talking nonsense here, fine, thanks to my style adjustments, I don't really notice (hah!) it, anyway.

SNy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Castorix said:

Just to add that the "Hytbold: A Guide to Rebuilding and Armour" from Fredelas was probably the best and most useful guide for LOTRO that all my kin and myself used for months and I was totally taken aback when I learnt he had be banned for nothing....

You must of not seen his post in the HD beta forums but then again you would probably say it was ok what he said.

I was in HD beta & I have to say I have to laugh at many who go on & on & on how bad Sapience was in those forums but neglect to event talk about how nasty many players were to Turbine employees in those forums.

Cordovan, you got your work cut out for you dealing with this bunch. Just take a gander at there posting history. They have sat & belittled, poked fun of players who posted on the original forums, there no better here then the OF.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, lotro16 said:

You must of not seen his post in the HD beta forums but then again you would probably say it was ok what he said.

I was in HD beta & I have to say I have to laugh at many who go on & on & on how bad Sapience was in those forums but neglect to event talk about how nasty many players were to Turbine employees in those forums.

Cordovan, you got your work cut out for you dealing with this bunch. Just take a gander at there posting history. They have sat & belittled, poked fun of players who posted on the original forums, there no better here then the OF.

 

Yes, I saw his last post - the one that got him banned.What exactly was wrong with his post? It was polite, well written and accurate. It was a response to the community manager being snarky and rude to a customer. The CM was also factually wrong. Fredelas also pointed out that the communication from Turbine had been antagonistic in the Beta: it had been, and it was one of the reasons I stopped playing the game for 6 months, along with disgust at Fredelas' ban. 

Anyone with a decent grasp of the English language and basic reading comprehension skills would find no fault with that post. You're nothing but a troll and are derailing this thread. 

 

 

Cordovan,

I wish you luck in your new job - a very difficult one I imagine it will be.

I agree with what most of the others say; more open and as honest communication as possible; no favouritism on the forums whatsoever; and a proper statement about the license renewal would be most welcome.

CMs can and do have a lot of influence on customers. When playing LOTRO,I would read the forums everyday. I steadily came to lose respect for Turbine due to the tone and manner of the communication on the forums, and it affected my opinion of the game. Whenever I saw the CM be nasty or rude, it made me less inclined to spend money on the game and in the end it made me vow to spend as little on the game as possible. 

Basic politeness and manners go a long way with people.

I don't play the game anymore. For the first time in 5 years, I did not purchase the latest update. As you can see from this forum, there is no longer much talk about LOTRO. To me the game has become stagnant and I have little interest in it.

I think many customers who took part in the HD beta are very bitter and angry about the way our feedback was dismissed and responded to in an unprofessional manner. Yes, Sapience might not work for Turbine anymore, but the CM is the face and voice of the company and the two after awhile almost merge into one entity.

I think there is a lot of ill feeling towards Turbine that may be very difficult for you to assuage. I think you coming here to post and build bridges is wonderful but I am not sure of what it will do now: Sapience seriously damaged your company's reputation and many of us don't forget. Nor do we forget that Turbine let him do what he wanted for years and did nothing to stop him which logically one can conclude was because they approved and sanctioned his behaviour.

What would get me playing again and spending money?

Honestly, I don't think you in your role could have any effect on that anymore as only new content could persuade me to return; new content that is not big battles, essence grinds, or repeatable dailies. I cannot stress how much I detest big battles. I also miss non-essence crafted gear.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Freelorn and Vyvanne lied about the EU data center. Freelorn also later admitted that the servers were set up to cut expenses, not improve the hardware for the game. Which is very different than what they told players initially. That was a major deception.  

If Turbine and Cordovan do not actively try to deceive players, then that will be a big change.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you not logged out after 6 hours of inactivity on the OF?? This was implemented when the forums were changed 3 (ish?) years ago. It was originally a 1/2 hour but was changed after a month or two at player (and PC) urging, iirc.

Not that I get worked up about the little blurb across the top of the OF. Until this thread I'd never even read more than 3 words of it. Its message is implicit or explicit on many many internet forums. Nothing sinister in it, imo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I definitely think that a reassesment and possible amnesty of people banned would be worthwhile, assuming there weren't threatening or truly obnoxious posts.  but those people allowed to return would obviously have flags attached to their accounts.

As far as people demanding information on the license renewal.  CM's and developers don't have the authority to do that on their own,  assuming they even know, and if they circumvent that they'll be fired.  Given how small the industry is, good luck getting another job in that field.

If they had been able to renew, it would have been in their best interest to announce that.  That license isn't likely to be cheap, so the odds are probably strongly in favor of the license for LOTRO ending in 2017.  But, the one hope is the fact that it takes so long to develop an MMO that maybe something could be worked out where it stays hosted until a replacement releases.  Just as SWG stayed up until just before SWTOR released.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Castorix said:

Just to add that the "Hytbold: A Guide to Rebuilding and Armour" from Fredelas was probably the best and most useful guide for LOTRO that all my kin and myself used for months and I was totally taken aback when I learnt he had be banned for nothing....

Same here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...