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Morder Pre-Purchase Packages Announced

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1 hour ago, Doro said:

And it's not like you can even just play like the old days in Eriador and stop at 50. They've ruined so much that the old content isn't even there any more. There's pretty much no semblance of vanilla LotRO left, which is probably the most annoying thing Turbine ever did with the game. It wasn't just that they made bad new content, it's that they took away what little good content we did have (especially by adding those annoying as fuck trait trees that gimped every character).

I used to get so mad because for years the epic book quest in the Lonelands where you have to kill gaunt men and retrieve 5 hearts or heads was marked as a solo quest, and for a long time, it very much wasn't.  I always felt like instead of fixing that one issue by simply marking it as a fellowship quest, they turned around and made it so that your raven could solo gaunt men indefinitely while you were afk.  It's like, instead of fixing......ANYTHING, they just made the game easy to play by facerolling the keyboard.  I could never get past that.  Simply destroyed the game for me, and certainly destroyed any replay value.

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To be fair to Turbine with regards to the difficulty, they weren't the only company to do that: everyone pretty much has made their MMORPG easy. Secret World has just relaunched as Secret World Legends with a drastically reduced difficulty level. WOW became incredibly easy years ago. Even the main quest content of Final Fantasy XIV is very easy. 

SSG need to have a subscription only legacy server of Shadows of Angmar. I imagine they would make a tidy profit from it, but I think they have said that it would not be possible as they no longer have the code.

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2 hours ago, Doro said:

 (especially by adding those annoying as fuck trait trees that gimped every character).

This was a big reason I stopped playing when I did. Trait trees were the final nail in the coffin for me.

I'm honestly hoping another company gets a shot a making a LoTR-MMO. Surely someone can put the rights to better use.

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I'm surprised no one has reverse engineered SoA and made an emulator the way people did for Everquest, WoW, Dark Age of Camelot, and Star Wars Galaxies.

It goes to show you just how little interest there is in the gaming community for LOTRO, even in its prime.

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56 minutes ago, psalm8818 said:

I'm surprised no one has reverse engineered SoA and made an emulator the way people did for Everquest, WoW, Dark Age of Camelot, and Star Wars Galaxies.

It goes to show you just how little interest there is in the gaming community for LOTRO, even in its prime.

Sadly, trying to release MoM against WoW:WotLK just got LotRO clobbered... and then following that release by SoM (which has to be the most pathetic expansion for a sub game I've seen yet) just totaled the player base.

Yeah, there were some good times to be had at RoI, but by the time that RoR came about and they completely destroyed the raiding community by removing raid locks, LotRO was essentially dead right there.  HD was the last gasp, and the great irony that by switching to trees actually destroyed the only way that LotRO could do a down-leveling system that would actually make all instances relevant at endgame.... so you end up with a lot of dev work going into instances... and no way to leverage them to help keep the playerbase busy years down the road.

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On ‎12‎-‎08‎-‎2017 at 7:28 AM, Amorey said:

We must agree it is important to let people freely express their own views even if those views are different. I can easily take a step back and I will, but others around here must do the same, that to me is a fair game. 

You unleashed an open season on OF, don't try to step back now bitch.

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On ‎13‎-‎08‎-‎2017 at 10:47 PM, psalm8818 said:

I'm surprised no one has reverse engineered SoA and made an emulator the way people did for Everquest, WoW, Dark Age of Camelot, and Star Wars Galaxies.

It goes to show you just how little interest there is in the gaming community for LOTRO, even in its prime.

There was close to zero interest (I think there is one thread in this forum about it) in the past, nothing more than a random request here and there. I doubt someone would waste time on a game that does not even run well on its own servers.

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5 hours ago, Trisswyn said:

There was close to zero interest (I think there is one thread in this forum about it) in the past, nothing more than a random request here and there. I doubt someone would waste time on a game that does not even run well on its own servers.

Performance is awful now.  I thought it might have been just while the beta was running, but it's still the slowest I've seen it since right around the time the world closures started.

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24 minutes ago, warspeech said:

Performance is awful now.  I thought it might have been just while the beta was running, but it's still the slowest I've seen it since right around the time the world closures started.

I've noticed that too and it has changed my mind about purchasing Mordor. Did some dailies at North gate around Minas Tirith and I crashed to desktop whenever I ported. Lag and warsteed rubberbanding was the worst I have ever experienced. I purchased a swift travel to Mordor with a Mithril Coin and crashed to desktop before I even got there. The auction house on my server is barer than it was before the server mergers. I eventually had a look around Mordor. The landscape looked better than I imaged, but there were very few players around which indicated to me that it has not sold very well.

A sad state of affairs all around I think. Indefensible.  I won't be purchasing Mordor and will probably uninstall the entire game.

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3 hours ago, Mallorn said:

I've noticed that too and it has changed my mind about purchasing Mordor. Did some dailies at North gate around Minas Tirith and I crashed to desktop whenever I ported. Lag and warsteed rubberbanding was the worst I have ever experienced. I purchased a swift travel to Mordor with a Mithril Coin and crashed to desktop before I even got there. The auction house on my server is barer than it was before the server mergers. I eventually had a look around Mordor. The landscape looked better than I imaged, but there were very few players around which indicated to me that it has not sold very well.

A sad state of affairs all around I think. Indefensible.  I won't be purchasing Mordor and will probably uninstall the entire game.

Is there anything that can be done to mitigate the crash to desktop (besides dropping all graphical settings to minimum)?

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On 14.8.2017 at 3:47 AM, psalm8818 said:

I'm surprised no one has reverse engineered SoA and made an emulator the way people did for Everquest, WoW, Dark Age of Camelot, and Star Wars Galaxies.

It goes to show you just how little interest there is in the gaming community for LOTRO, even in its prime.

I seem to remember that, at least for the WoW server clones, the code wasn't actually reverse engineered, but obtained through a leak of sorts?

Even if you decrypted and reverse-engineered the protocol, you would be very far from having the server side actually do things in a way the client expects. So I think it's rather not a big surprise this hasn't been done (attempted?).

Also, don't forget DMCA etc. Slippery terrain there, not much to gain, much to lose.

SNy

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On 14.08.2017 at 3:47 AM, psalm8818 said:

I'm surprised no one has reverse engineered SoA and made an emulator the way people did for Everquest, WoW, Dark Age of Camelot, and Star Wars Galaxies.

It goes to show you just how little interest there is in the gaming community for LOTRO, even in its prime.

Emulator would only happen if Lotro would get closed when still relatively popular.   I.e. around 2011-2012 if Lotro playerbase would reject F2P and quality drop leaving in droves and Turbine closing servers.   In that time I believe there would be enough interest from community to attempt to make an emulator.

41 minutes ago, SNy said:

I seem to remember that, at least for the WoW server clones, the code wasn't actually reverse engineered, but obtained through a leak of sorts?

Even if you decrypted and reverse-engineered the protocol, you would be very far from having the server side actually do things in a way the client expects. So I think it's rather not a big surprise this hasn't been done (attempted?).

 

Most MMORPG emulators are made via sniffing packets and saving whatever server send to client while travelling through game, zone after zone, dungeon after dungeon + data digging client files which produce data that help to code server side stuff. Of course it takes a LONG time to decypher all of this.   Server side stuff such as AI routines, scripting, quest triggers, boundaries (so i.e. player dont go through wall), etc are coded by emulator developers.   Thousands upon thousands of hours of coding.  That is why it takes years for emulators to provide anything close to full functionality of official server.

Some emulator servers even have their code on Github or something like that so you can see for yourself.

Stolen official server code via hacks or employees stealing and releasing code are very rare.  I don't remember any actual example of such thing happening, certainly not in last 5-8 years in western MMORPG.

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1 hour ago, Almagnus1 said:

Is there anything that can be done to mitigate the crash to desktop (besides dropping all graphical settings to minimum)?

Haven't looked into it to be honest. 

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When I reinstalled LOTRO to check out the update, I actually went with the standard client rather than high res.  I thought maybe it was a question of memory that was causing me to crash every 10 minutes, but it turns out that the graphics didn't even enter into it.  I mean, I was CTDing simply farming beans in Bree.  Maybe we shouldn't be so surprised the Mordor launch trailer looked like Michael Scott slapped it together 10 minutes before a conference meeting.

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4 hours ago, drul said:

Emulator would only happen if Lotro would get closed when still relatively popular.   I.e. around 2011-2012 if Lotro playerbase would reject F2P and quality drop leaving in droves and Turbine closing servers.   In that time I believe there would be enough interest from community to attempt to make an emulator.

I don't think there's enough players left that care enough about LotRO to do that.

Quote

Most MMORPG emulators are made via sniffing packets and saving whatever server send to client while travelling through game, zone after zone, dungeon after dungeon + data digging client files which produce data that help to code server side stuff. Of course it takes a LONG time to decypher all of this.   Server side stuff such as AI routines, scripting, quest triggers, boundaries (so i.e. player dont go through wall), etc are coded by emulator developers.   Thousands upon thousands of hours of coding.  That is why it takes years for emulators to provide anything close to full functionality of official server.

How possible would it be to use a Lua program to dump the quests and items to disk?

That would DEFINITELY help cut out a lot of the reconstruction work.

Quote

Stolen official server code via hacks or employees stealing and releasing code are very rare.  I don't remember any actual example of such thing happening, certainly not in last 5-8 years in western MMORPG.

IMO there's not really been a western MMO failure in the last couple of years worth saving.

Only time will tell, as most of the F2P MMOs are probably not going to be around in 5-10 years.

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18 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

I don't think there's enough players left that care enough about LotRO to do that.

 

Now for sure not.  Imo last chance was in 2011, MAYBE in 2012. 

18 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

How possible would it be to use a Lua program to dump the quests and items to disk?

That would DEFINITELY help cut out a lot of the reconstruction work.

No idea. Emulators are not my area of expertise - I only know about them what I've read, but I never met or heard about an emulator that would get official quest scripting.  Those scripts/code is on official server and is not sent to client AFAIK,  so emulator developers have to write quest scripting themself.   Whatever they get from packets send by official server to client does NOT contain quest scripting (or at least they get only some bits) afaik.  I might be wrong - like I've said I never done any emulator work, but that is what I've read.

18 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

IMO there's not really been a western MMO failure in the last couple of years worth saving.

Only time will tell, as most of the F2P MMOs are probably not going to be around in 5-10 years.

MMORPGs definately failed, they hit a wall in their developement as a genre, unable to keep up with players expectations. 

As far as I am concerned by years long of MMORPGs hiatus have NOT lowered my expectations, opposite in fact. If I am ever to pour hundreads of hours into an MMOPRG - they would have to PROVIDE huge amount of quality.  For sure I don't want play those god awful boring and cheap grind-gameplay anymore.  So currently even Lotro from it's golden age with updated graphics would not convinced me to play.  It would have to be much better than Lotro (or any other MMORPG to date in fact) ever was.

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On ‎8‎/‎16‎/‎2017 at 8:26 AM, drul said:

As far as I am concerned by years long of MMORPGs hiatus have NOT lowered my expectations, opposite in fact. If I am ever to pour hundreads of hours into an MMOPRG - they would have to PROVIDE huge amount of quality.  For sure I don't want play those god awful boring and cheap grind-gameplay anymore.  So currently even Lotro from it's golden age with updated graphics would not convinced me to play.  It would have to be much better than Lotro (or any other MMORPG to date in fact) ever was.

 You may want to do free trial of FFXIV, as it's actually really good later on (initial story writer did some stupid stuff like how the lead up into Titan was handled, but it improves from there).

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5 hours ago, psalm8818 said:

I get the tangible sense you're trying to get everyone to play that game. :P

well, to be fair...it is a great game :)

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44 minutes ago, Papi said:

well, to be fair...it is a great game :)

I played up to level 50 but got sick of it. Thought the story was too campy, unepic and lacklustre. Hated the small environments and mechanical animations of the mounts. I found crafting to be a boring grind. Fates were good at first, but got boring very quickly and I hated the fact that they needed to be grinded over and over as the quests themselves did not provide enough experience in the later levels to reach cap.

I thought the group content was very well designed, but hated the fact that they were incorporated into the storyline so that one had to complete a certain instance before you could progress. At cap, the thought of levelling up my crafting and grinding group instances over and over did not make me want to play the game.

I think FFXIV is a perfect example of how group content is treated as a means to an end - a factory production line - just to gain barter tokens. It is  impossible to follow the crucial story cut scenes in certain group content because the other players all want to skip it as they just want to get through the instance as quick as possible so that they can do another and another and another. This is not good for players who have been following the story and then suddenly are not allowed to by the other players.

Technically, yes it is a great game, but not for me. Other Final Fantasys have had much better storylines. I don't like being forced to do group content; I want to choose to do it, and I don't want to do it over and over and over and over to get tokens as it strips all the fun away.

As another poster said earlier in this thread, I think MMORPGs have stagnated with regards to design. 

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25 minutes ago, Mallorn said:

It is  impossible to follow the crucial story cut scenes in certain group content because the other players all want to skip it as they just want to get through the instance as quick as possible so that they can do another and another and another. This is not good for players who have been following the story and then suddenly are not allowed to by the other players.

 

The game isn't for everyone, I won't deny that...but I'm not sure this statement is correct.  For starters, the dungeons won't officially start (allow players to move) until all players have seen the appropriate cut scene.  Also, you can always view these story scenes by visiting an inn at a major city and retiring to a room where all cinematics are available.  The only thing stopping you from seeing those crucial cut scenes is...well, you.

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When I played FFXIV, it was even worse than LOTRO is today.  But I understand they did a major revamp of the entire game.  And I do like the FF series, but the let's play videos I've watched make it really look like game geared towards 7 year-olds.  Probably not exactly fair, but I've learned to go with my instincts when it comes to MMOs.  That said, right now FFXIV's strongest selling point is that Amorey isn't playing it.

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1 hour ago, psalm8818 said:

That said, right now FFXIV's strongest selling point is that Amorey isn't playing it.

You've got some serious issues if that woman continues to occupy that much space in your head.  You're making her look sane in comparison.

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9 hours ago, Papi said:

The game isn't for everyone, I won't deny that...but I'm not sure this statement is correct.  For starters, the dungeons won't officially start (allow players to move) until all players have seen the appropriate cut scene.  Also, you can always view these story scenes by visiting an inn at a major city and retiring to a room where all cinematics are available.  The only thing stopping you from seeing those crucial cut scenes is...well, you.

 

Some instances have multiple cut scenes throughout. I got told off and left behind when doing The Praetorium because I was watching a cut scene. After that I had to skip every one of the succeeding ones. A few other players got locked out of bosses because they watched a cut scene, got  left behind and then could not catch up as no one would wait for them because most of the players were not doing the instance for the first time but were simply grinding it.  I did not have a clue what was going on from a story perspective and it ruined what was supposed to be the climax of the main game storyline.

Yes, I could view the cut scenes later, but I wanted to experience the instance as it was meant to be. Not rush through it at breakneck speed and then try and cobble the story together from disparate cut scenes at an inn.

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1 hour ago, Papi said:

You've got some serious issues if that woman continues to occupy that much space in your head.  You're making her look sane in comparison.

Dude.....scroll up, and read some of the things she's said about multiple people here (including a moderator).  Is that someone YOU want to play a video game with?

29 minutes ago, Mallorn said:

 

Some instances have multiple cut scenes throughout. I got told off and left behind when doing The Praetorium because I was watching a cut scene. After that I had to skip every one of the succeeding ones. A few other players got locked out of bosses because they watched a cut scene, got  left behind and then could not catch up as no one would wait for them because most of the players were not doing the instance for the first time but were simply grinding it.  I did not have a clue what was going on from a story perspective and it ruined what was supposed to be the climax of the main game storyline.

Yes, I could view the cut scenes later, but I wanted to experience the instance as it was meant to be. Not rush through it at breakneck speed and then try and cobble the story together from disparate cut scenes at an inn.

That's a big issue with SWTOR's group instances.  There are actual moral choices you are expected to make that not only effect your light/dark side alignment, but the level of favor you gain from your companions.  But other players just want you to blow through that stuff without thinking so they can get their purplz.  If you don't comply, they WILL kick you from group.  I'd rather play single player games than put up with assholes like that.

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