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psalm8818

World of Warcraft "Classic"

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Blizzard sure has backpedalled from the infamous "You think you want it, but you really don't" Q&A.

I think ultimately people playing vanilla WoW FOR FREE on private servers will continue to do so (unless, of course, Blizzard is using this as an excuse to take sweeping legal action against private servers), either because 1).  Blizzard follows the Everquest model and simply timelocks content rather than actually emulating the classic game, or 2). No one plays it because it can take over 45 minutes to complete a kill quest in vanilla because of all the downtime, or 3). vanilla advocates realize that they in fact didn't really want it.  I'm currently playing on 2 different local LAN servers using the 2 best project databases (1 vanilla, 1 Wrath of the Lich King) and frankly, I enjoy WOTLK far more than vanilla.  

But I still maintain that the only reason Blizzard is doing this is to shut down vanilla emulator servers, because if those playing on EMUs aren't satisfied with the live product, they're not going to stick around.  And damned if today's WoW kewl dewd is going to put up with anything less than instant gratification and participation trophies.

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I dunno... it seems like it has a community that's going to keep it as it was in vanilla, at least initially.

Content is going to be released in six waves, so it looks like it could be an interesting experience to redo vanilla with everything I know now.

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/classic-pvp-content-plan/146049

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/classic-content-plan/120346

If it stays as it was then, the only way it's going to be easier is because we already know most of the instances and have good guides on them.

Either way, it'll be fun to go screw around as a Tauren this summer, and see the world unscrewed up.

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I played the original Warcraft RTS back when that first came out but I've never actually played even a second of WoW.

Somewhat considering giving classic a go if it means a relatively challenging landscape for a duo.

 

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35 minutes ago, Bohemond said:

I played the original Warcraft RTS back when that first came out but I've never actually played even a second of WoW.

Somewhat considering giving classic a go if it means a relatively challenging landscape for a duo.

There are going to be places where you need a group, and get ready to hike to every instance... and no flying.  Do NOT play on a PvP server if you don't want to deal with random ganking whenever you're in a contested zone as even a stealth class isn't going to help you there.

It was fun, it was challenging, and as they're not screwing up the content waves with the releases, it's going to be good for a while.

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46 minutes ago, Lexicus said:

Just wondering who here will be playing?

For myself going to give it a shot as a horde shaman or warlock.

If I'm going to be playing, it's a tauren druid on a US PvP realm.

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14 hours ago, Lexicus said:

Just wondering who here will be playing?

For myself going to give it a shot as a horde shaman or warlock.

It will depend on how "Classic" it actually is.  If it's anything like LOTRO's "Classic" servers, then I'll pass. One would hope Blizzard is smarter than that, but then again we're talking about a company that made the next Diablo game for mobile phones and wondered why gamers were outraged.

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I've been thinking about it, because by the time I started playing, the new-player experience of the world was very disjointed.  There was so much cut out and rearranged from all the various expansions that I never did get a sense of a coherent story that unfolded logically and sequentially.

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1 hour ago, warspeech said:

I've been thinking about it, because by the time I started playing, the new-player experience of the world was very disjointed.  There was so much cut out and rearranged from all the various expansions that I never did get a sense of a coherent story that unfolded logically and sequentially.

That's what made WoW kinda awesome initially... there never was a coherent overarching story, just a whole bunch of questlines that told smaller vignettes.

5 hours ago, psalm8818 said:

It will depend on how "Classic" it actually is.  If it's anything like LOTRO's "Classic" servers, then I'll pass. One would hope Blizzard is smarter than that, but then again we're talking about a company that made the next Diablo game for mobile phones and wondered why gamers were outraged.

From what they were saying at last BlizzCon, while it's running the modern WoW server code, they basically took a copy of the 1.12 WoW Server setup, massaged to the DB and assets to work on modern client, and it's basically a mod that uses the modern WoW server code yet behaves basically like 1.12, so we will be starting with the release content and 1.12 systems.  I'd call that a good compromise because that way druids aren't a complete cluster throughout most of the Classic content release cycle.  From what Blizzard has said, sharding will be around for launch, but turned off later as Blizzard doesn't want to recreate the Vanilla launch experience and they only want to have it on long enough to get players to properly seed the world.  I'm hoping Blizzard actually sticks to their word on this, as I'm fine with shards initially as I don't want to go through that shitshow again.

That said, I'm hoping Blizzard has enough balls to tell the retail retards to go sod off when they'll inevitably try to "modernize" Classic.

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20 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

That's what made WoW kinda awesome initially... there never was a coherent overarching story, just a whole bunch of questlines that told smaller vignettes.

Good to know, saves me the trouble of downloading it then.

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13 hours ago, warspeech said:

Good to know, saves me the trouble of downloading it then.

Did you ever play the original World of WarCraft?

If you're expecting a LotRO or FFXIV style story then you're clearly looking at the wrong game.

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This is a post from the community manager on the content release cycle proposed for Classic:

 

At BlizzCon 2018, we proposed a plan to give Classic four content phases. These were planned to be centered primarily on raid power progression.

Currently, based on both your feedback and our own deliberations, we’re now planning to increase it to six phases. Our focus is still primarily on player power-progression, but we’re also aiming to capture what it felt like to play in a realm community in original WoW. To do that, we’re planning to mirror the approach taken by original WoW, with patches paired together. We’ll launch Classic with content from original WoW through patch 1.2.x, then the second update will include content that was in original WoW 1.3 and 1.4, the third Classic update will have 1.5 and 1.6 content, and so on.

Our first phase primarily focuses on launching Classic with Onyxia and Molten Core, but we’ve decided to hold off on Dire Maul for a while. Maraudon is still in the first phase, because it was originally released on December 18, 2004, just two weeks after the first player hit level 60, but we recognize that Dire Maul is in a different category. Some of the loot that’s attainable from Dire Maul is so good that it would affect progression through those early raids. We’re also planning to hold off on releasing Kazzak and Azuregos at launch as well, for the same reasons.

The next change we’re targeting addresses two concerns. First, Zul’Gurub and Blackwing Lair unlocking at the same time would differ from how they originally came out, and it makes sense to not have gear and enchants from Zul’Gurub available during early progress into Blackwing Lair. Secondly, the Emerald Dragons should be available earlier than the opening of Ahn’Qiraj, as they give us a way to start preparing nature resist gear for some of the encounters in AQ.

Along the way, we’ve taken a close look at items that provide the biggest power gains, many of which were introduced in 1.10 as part of a sweeping dungeon itemization pass. That patch was when Tier 0.5 gear was introduced, and Relics were added to the drop tables of many bosses. It also adjusted drop rates and drop locations of a lot of gear (to make room for the Relics). We’ve gone back and reconstructed many of the most heavily affected drop tables as they existed prior to the 1.10 patch, and we’re planning to update the drop tables alongside the Ahn’Qiraj War Effort. Prior to the Ahn’Qiraj unlock, most of the drop rates and locations will look as they did in the patches prior to 1.10, with exceptions—there are lots of little changes made in earlier patches that don’t have a big effect on player power, and in those cases, we’re planning to use the 1.12 drop rates and locations.

One example of the many items we’re planning for is: Titanic Leggings, which is a world drop that first appeared in 1.10. We can confirm that it will be controlled by the same content unlock that restricts the other 1.10 loot changes.

Here’s what the release order currently looks like:

Phase 1 (Classic Launch)

  • Molten Core
  • Onyxia
  • Maraudon

Phase 2

  • Dire Maul
  • Azuregos
  • Kazzak

Phase 3

  • Blackwing Lair
  • Darkmoon Faire
  • Darkmoon deck drops begin

Phase 4

  • Zul’Gurub
  • Green Dragons

Phase 5

  • Ahn’Qiraj War Effort begins
  • Ahn’Qiraj raids open when the war effort dictates
  • Dungeon loot reconfiguration: Tier 0.5 Dungeon gear, Relics, drop rates and location changes

Phase 6

  • Naxxramas
  • Scourge Invasion

We haven’t yet determined exactly when phases 2-6 will occur, and PvP content is notably missing from the list above. That’s because we’re still evaluating our options regarding PvP rewards, as they also changed over time (both in power and in terms of which PvP reward items were available).

Barrens Chat forums have some good resources on it and discussion about WoW Classic found at https://barrens.chat/ 

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And for those of us that played for the PvP instead of that PvE non-sense here's https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/classic-pvp-content-plan/146049 :

Since we broke down the six phases of content that we’ll be rolling out for Classic, we’ve heard the increase in requests for PvP details so we wanted to get you up to speed on our plans there.

As was the case when World of Warcraft originally launched in 2004, there won’t be a formal PvP system in WoW Classic at the outset. You’ll still be able to PvP, of course, and there will be no Dishonorable Kills, so you’ll be free to repeatedly hunt down every player and NPC in, say, Stranglethorn Vale to your stealthy heart’s content.

That’ll change once phase 2 rolls around and we add the Honor System, which will introduce Honorable Kills, Dishonorable Kills, and PvP Rank Rewards. The items you earn from the PvP Rank Rewards will be the versions from patch 1.12. Keep in mind though, just as it did originally, it will require a substantial time investment to rank up through the Honor System. For those interested in the Rank Rewards, earning epic gear will require consistent dedication over a long period of time as a top contributor on your realm. We don’t expect to see many people running around with these items early on, but we’re certain Hillsbrad Foothills will still see its fair share of action!

In the third phase, we’ll introduce the first Battlegrounds: Alterac Valley (version 1.12 3.4k) and Warsong Gulch, alongside with their associated vendors. One thing to note is that there were a couple of updates to these vendors over the course of the original patch releases, so some items won’t be available right away. For example, the Spell Penetration trinkets available from the Warsong Gulch vendor weren’t introduced until Patch 1.9, so we’re currently thinking that we’ll add these in phase 5.

The Arathi Basin Battleground will follow in phase 4, along with its specific vendor. It’ll be interesting to see how many people stay behind to guard the flag. 😉

Finally, in phase 6, we’ll have the world PvP objectives in Silithus and Eastern Plaguelands, which will come out at the same time as Naxxramas.

Here’s what the PvP content looks like mapped to the phases we recently posted about:

Phase 1 (WoW Classic Launch)

  • You can PvP one another in the world, but there is no tracking, and no formal rewards for doing so.

Phase 2

  • Honor System (including Dishonorable Kills)
  • PvP Rank Rewards

Phase 3

  • Alterac Valley (version 1.12 3.4k)
  • Warsong Gulch

Phase 4

  • Arathi Basin

Phase 6

  • World PvP objectives in Silithus and Eastern Plaguelands

As we mentioned before, we haven’t yet determined exactly when each of the content phases will occur but we’ll keep you updated as they draw closer.

We’re here reading what you have to say, so we wanted to thank all of you for your feedback and discussions about Classic. Keep it going!

So bringing it together, here's the PvE/PvP release schedule:

Phase 1 (WoW Classic Launch)

  • Molten Core
  • Onyxia
  • Maraudon
  • You can PvP one another in the world, but there is no tracking, and no formal rewards for doing so.

Phase 2

  • Dire Maul
  • Azuregos
  • Kazzak
  • Honor System (including Dishonorable Kills)
  • PvP Rank Rewards

Phase 3

  • Blackwing Lair
  • Darkmoon Faire
  • Darkmoon deck drops begin
  • Alterac Valley (version 1.12 3.4k)
  • Warsong Gulch

Phase 4

  • Zul’Gurub
  • Green Dragons
  • Arathi Basin

Phase 5

  • Ahn’Qiraj War Effort begins
  • Ahn’Qiraj raids open when the war effort dictates
  • Dungeon loot reconfiguration: Tier 0.5 Dungeon gear, Relics, drop rates and location changes

Phase 6

  • Naxxramas
  • Scourge Invasion
  • World PvP objectives in Silithus and Eastern Plaguelands

My thoughts on this:

PvE content is released at a good pace, PvP servers are going to start off fairly carebear-ish in Phase 1, and then the world will burn in Phase 2 as that's when it makes sense to go out to the contested zones and hunt down the other faction as you're getting rep from them, which will also turn up the dial on like Tarren Mill/Southshoore to 11.  Ideally you will want to hit 60 in phase 1 (which is going to be a process as getting to 60 back in the day was no small feat), and then focus on getting geared out to do whatever you want to do.  If you're on a PvP server, you will learn to watch your back, as the 'Moors at their peak were a distillation of what made Vanilla world PvP so much fun, and it's what LotRO tried (and failed) to copy.

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And from https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/how-many-characters-can-we-create-in-classic/163599/23 :

In WoW Classic, you’ll have the following character limits per WoW account:

  • A maximum of 10 characters per WoW Classic realm
  • A maximum of 50 characters across all of the WoW Classic realms in your region
  • Only one faction per realm on PvP realms
  • No overlap or regard with the character limits in Battle for Azeroth

You’ll be able to have up to 50 Battle for Azeroth characters and up to 50 WoW Classic characters at the same time.

And that's what I had hoped would happen, as that's how Classic did things.

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there is something that i think everyone is over-looking in this nostalgia fest...

the July 8-10 2008 merger of Activision Games & BLIZZARD Entertainment.

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/activision-blizzard-merger-official/1100-6193580/

and the ensuing changes that resulted from this merger...  BATTLENET 2.0, R.L. - ID controversy & all the company cultural changes as a result.

yes Vanilla WoW was from a time pre-Activision Merger and i think that might actually be a huge unspoken component of the appetite for this thing...  but i never played World of Warcraft.  only thing i ever did touch related to WoW was the off-line campaign (story) for (i think it may have been) frozen throne???  and then played a actual live match of Warcraft 3.

i just don't think enough people have factored in this MASSIVE detail.

i was fairly confident that BLIZZARD would make a dent in the MOBA genre with HoTS, but the old BLIZZARD magic wasn't enough & now even HoTS is a footnote in the company.

...

what i am is an old Starcraft player...  2002 - 2005 ish.  and while i have a deep respect for what BLIZZARD Entertainement had done and become up until that point, i never even thought of jumping into Starcraft 2.0.  the single biggest factor behind that was Activision & the impact that merger had on the entire company culture.

while i never played Vanilla WoW,  i can see why the nostalgia for something pre-Activision Merger 2008 has an appeal...

i don't think i have heard anyone acknowledge this Elephant of a detail.

either way, i have no reason to play this.  or anything since that 2008 merger.  just isn't the same company IMO and they have been running off the fumes of the former ever since.

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Heh. Running off fumes for over a decade. I don't think people give 1 iota of a shit about whatever merger there was in 2008.

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Well, here's the start times and other relevant info for WoW Classic:

https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/22990080/mark-your-calendars-wow-classic-launch-and-testing-schedule

Quote

Americas (PDT)

Europe (CEST)

Taiwan (CST)

Korea (KST)

ANZ (AEST)

UTC

3:00 p.m.

12:00 a.m.

6:00 a.m.

7:00 a.m.

8:00 a.m.

10:00 p.m.

August 26*

August 27

August 27

August 27

August 27

August 26

 

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