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Legendary™ Servers

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16 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

Maybe the question we should be asking instead is:

How financially screwed is SSG?

Right now, it seems like there's no financial gain for SSG. It's being opened to VIPs and Lifers, not FTP/Premium players. Maybe at a later date, they'll offer access to the server as a for-pay product. They aren't even offering the Moors, at least at launch.

In general, though. I don't really see the point in this, since players can already use the Stone of the Tortoise on live and achieve the same results. It's typical Turbine/SSG - strike so close to the target, but miss it entirely. Players don't want to play the game in its current state; they want to experience the game as it was originally released in 2007/2008. Turbine/SSG already said they simply cannot do that, because the old code is simply gone: it's aged out of the version control system, disappeared in hardware/software upgrades and changes, or has become unusable due to modernization of hardware/software. Even if they had it, they would have to create a separate architecture - much like Bullroarer - to run it.

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Think of all the MMOs out there whose "vanilla" code has been reverse-engineered by non-professional fans into emulated servers (WoW, DAoC, Everquest, Star Wars Galaxies, etc.).  It's a shame LOTRO was never embraced in that regard.

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7 hours ago, psalm8818 said:

Think of all the MMOs out there whose "vanilla" code has been reverse-engineered by non-professional fans into emulated servers (WoW, DAoC, Everquest, Star Wars Galaxies, etc.).  It's a shame LOTRO was never embraced in that regard.

I think that has to do with the IP and licensing.  Considering how litigious MEE seems to be, if they weren't able to milk any licensing fees out of private "vanilla" servers then they would probably shut it down.  Blizzard has shut down at least one private server that I recall.  

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I wonder how popular the server would be if they took the store out for that server.  VIP and lifer only, keep all the content as it is now, but no store

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8 hours ago, cossieuk said:

I wonder how popular the server would be if they took the store out for that server.  VIP and lifer only, keep all the content as it is now, but no store

There is zero reason to even have the store since it is only available to Vip and lifetime accounts.  My guess is that more people would try it out if the store was removed.  They probably are banking on the fact that the majority of people that will even try this are Lifetime account holders and so they aren't going to get additional sub money.  I think lifetime accounts were a stupid idea.  Sure there was no guarantee that the game would last a decade but they shot themselves in the foot.  I'm sure plenty of lifers have spent more money over the years but their sense of entitlement and disdain for f2p players is toxic.

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I'm still in awe reading the comments on the official boards. For every 10 people that say this is a fucked up idea and devote resources to fixing what they already have there is 1 that thinks this is the best idea ever and cant wait for Nov 6th. One poster thinks that there will be flood of new subs and will be a massive cash infusion into the game. No new player is going to plunk down $15 a month for an 11 year old glitch-fest when there are 10 (?) free servers to play on

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4 hours ago, Altreg01 said:

I'm still in awe reading the comments on the official boards. For every 10 people that say this is a fucked up idea and devote resources to fixing what they already have there is 1 that thinks this is the best idea ever and cant wait for Nov 6th. One poster thinks that there will be flood of new subs and will be a massive cash infusion into the game. No new player is going to plunk down $15 a month for an 11 year old glitch-fest when there are 10 (?) free servers to play on

There are people that play that game who would let Cordovan brick in their mouth if it meant being mentioned on the live stream.  There is zero chance in hell that "new" players are going to flock to a legendary server.  When the Legendary server becomes just another server what will they do then?  Legendary classes?

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18 hours ago, Altreg01 said:

I'm still in awe reading the comments on the official boards. For every 10 people that say this is a fucked up idea and devote resources to fixing what they already have there is 1 that thinks this is the best idea ever and cant wait for Nov 6th. One poster thinks that there will be flood of new subs and will be a massive cash infusion into the game. No new player is going to plunk down $15 a month for an 11 year old glitch-fest when there are 10 (?) free servers to play on

$15/month and all the expansions on top of that?

 

There's quite a few lifers/VIPs who are happy to leave the f2p/premium players behind.

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The exclusiveness taste, but after that, it will be another ghost server. I doubt most lifers and VIP would want to abandon everything for a fresh start.

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Another thought:

I'm wondering if there isn't some scheme to use the Legendary server to help rebalance the low level content of the game while also generating revenue to help sustain LotRO.

That said, there's far better games out there.

On 10/26/2018 at 7:49 PM, psalm8818 said:

Think of all the MMOs out there whose "vanilla" code has been reverse-engineered by non-professional fans into emulated servers (WoW, DAoC, Everquest, Star Wars Galaxies, etc.).  It's a shame LOTRO was never embraced in that regard.

The truth (that many don't want to hear) is that LotRO COULD have been a WoW competitor, but that ship sailed west when they screwed up Mirkwood, and from that point forward it was all downhill from there.  LotRO turned off a lot of the dev fans by not officially supporting the plugin system, and then have the system have regression and new bugs appear basically at random.

Essentially, by catering to the casual and [E]RPers, LotRO drove off the players that would have normally helped build out the game and would have helped sustain it - kinda like what Blizzard is doing with the Big Friggin Atrocity.

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I think it went wrong with MoM already with the radiance system which made the game a lot more alt-unfriendly.
Itemization/gating has been a weak point of LotRO since Moria though you really started to notice that after Moria.

Though I agree SoM really started the way down, the expansion was too small, but not that bad, the idea behind the skirmish system also not bad, but the execution was poor. They focussed after Moria too much on the - failed - console version and the poorly executed transition to F2P, which costed them I think more than a year of development time and thát killed the game.

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On 10/27/2018 at 2:50 PM, cossieuk said:

I wonder how popular the server would be if they took the store out for that server.  VIP and lifer only, keep all the content as it is now, but no store

I wonder how popular the server would be if it would be a real classic server. With VIP only and no store, and everything like in 2007.

I think that at least 95% of the actual playerbase would switch over there, as well as thousands and thousands of players who had left would return, for old times sake.

This way they could cash in like crazy, but the actual legendary server will be dead in no time.

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4 hours ago, ibfe77 said:

I wonder how popular the server would be if it would be a real classic server. With VIP only and no store, and everything like in 2007.

I think that at least 95% of the actual playerbase would switch over there, as well as thousands and thousands of players who had left would return, for old times sake.

This way they could cash in like crazy, but the actual legendary server will be dead in no time.

Alas.

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On 10/30/2018 at 4:35 PM, ibfe77 said:

I wonder how popular the server would be if it would be a real classic server. With VIP only and no store, and everything like in 2007.

I think that at least 95% of the actual playerbase would switch over there, as well as thousands and thousands of players who had left would return, for old times sake.

This way they could cash in like crazy, but the actual legendary server will be dead in no time.

Id dive into that in a heartbeat.  I still have 750 travel rations in my shared storage that I hang on to for nostalgic reasons.  I still post a stack on the AH now and then hoping to get a collector to drop some coin since Im hardly rich

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On 10/30/2018 at 8:35 PM, ibfe77 said:

I wonder how popular the server would be if it would be a real classic server. With VIP only and no store, and everything like in 2007.

On the face of it, I'd say I'd play it, but then I think of the fact it all went so wrong before and I can't honestly trade so many hours of my life for a game that could go to shit with any update and make it all redundant. I keep well away from getting invested in MMOs now, simply because I know how it was when Trait Trees hit LotRO.

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They are already coming to the conclusion that a right out copy of regular servers is not going to cut it. Post from Cordovan, yesterday:

Quote

We too have been considering the pace of leveling on the Legendary server, and would be curious to hear more about your thoughts on XP gain:

Would you like us to curb the amount of XP gained on the Legendary server, and what pace do you prefer?

 

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?&postid=7883621#post7883621

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All I want is pre-trait trees.  That time when classes had versatility.  We wanted to be able to change traits without having to go to a bard.  They gave us trait trees.

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Just now, Amenhir said:

All I want is pre-trait trees.  That time when classes had versatility.  We wanted to be able to change traits without having to go to a bard.  They gave us trait trees.

It still gives me this feeling of disappointed anger to this day.

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2 hours ago, Tarantula said:

They are already coming to the conclusion that a right out copy of regular servers is not going to cut it. Post from Cordovan, yesterday:

I see alot of people on there talking about the "journey", it's all about the "journey."  What part of the "journey" from lvl 1-50 have these people not experienced yet?  The game is almost 12 years old.  These people probably have 4 accounts with 20 alts a piece.  I liked leveling up the first time but after the 3 or 4th time you do it, it gets kind of stale.  You can only ask yourself Lone Lands or North Downs so many times.

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48 minutes ago, Amenhir said:

I see alot of people on there talking about the "journey", it's all about the "journey."  What part of the "journey" from lvl 1-50 have these people not experienced yet?  The game is almost 12 years old.  These people probably have 4 accounts with 20 alts a piece.  I liked leveling up the first time but after the 3 or 4th time you do it, it gets kind of stale.  You can only ask yourself Lone Lands or North Downs so many times.

They forget that they can repeat that 'journey', for free, on the regular servers every day of every week, with or without excellerator.

Even people who want horses to be restricted till level 35 get the response 'go do that on a regular server, don't make me do that when I don't want to'.

Vastin is revamping the Beorning.

One poster is estimating that will take around 110,000 embers for one character to be outfitted, essences included. This would come down to lootboxes at a value of around $373/toon/upgrade.

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1 hour ago, Amenhir said:

All I want is pre-trait trees.  That time when classes had versatility.  We wanted to be able to change traits without having to go to a bard.  They gave us trait trees.

If they did that, I'd seriously consider trying it out.  LOTRO was my first MMO and back then I had no idea what I was doing.  I'd love to be able to go back and see it with fresh eyes  in the light of all the MMO experience I've had since then.  I doubt I'd care enough to level all the way to 50, but I could see myself going VIP for one month.

 

2 minutes ago, Tarantula said:

They forget that they can repeat that 'journey', for free, on the regular servers every day of every week, with or without excellerator.

 

People get so mad when you remind them of that, too. 

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11 minutes ago, warspeech said:

If they did that, I'd seriously consider trying it out.  LOTRO was my first MMO and back then I had no idea what I was doing.  I'd love to be able to go back and see it with fresh eyes  in the light of all the MMO experience I've had since then.  I doubt I'd care enough to level all the way to 50, but I could see myself going VIP for one month.

 

People get so mad when you remind them of that, too. 

They have this fuzzy kumbaya thing in their heads.  That the whole server will be a troll free utopia where everyone holds hands and levels up together.  It's bullshit and it will be exactly like all the other servers.   They seem to think that assholes and trolls don't subscribe.  In fact I wouldn't be surprised if the worst offenders don't subscribe specifically to fuck with them.

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1 hour ago, Amenhir said:

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if the worst offenders don't subscribe specifically to fuck with them.

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On 10/26/2018 at 3:44 AM, Doro said:

The biggest question for me is if you had to start all over again on a game, why start on a corpse like LotRO? The people who want to just faff about in low levels are already doing that. The people who want the original content won't get it. I doubt there are any actual raiders left, and even those have spent years getting their actual characters ready so wouldn't abandon them for a completely unconnected set. PvPers aren't included at all, not that current PvP works anyway. What few new players exist are being asked to pay when they can just get exactly the same game for free. And it's not exactly going to bring any old players back because the majority of old players gave up and stopped reading about the game years ago. I can't place the motive behind this.

The Legendary server explains why all the starting zone revamps. None of which were ask for. The land connections in old content areas. Which no one ask for. The Core stat redistributions. Which no one ask for. This becomes clear when looking back. I expect this server to flop on its face in a few months. I also don't see who is going to pay for it. I know I wont. Especially knowing all the lifers wont pay a dime, I wont support it with my money.  I sure won't pay for what I already paid for twice now. So who is going to pay for it? Hmm?

No PvMP? So they say not at launch. Ya only way it will happen is if they realize their effort is doomed. Then and only then will they open the Moors and then is so it wont be the same PvMP because Severlin said he wants something different than what we have had. Thing is by the time they conclude it is a necessary it will be too late for them.

 

Disregarding all I put above, I can answer to the motive. This is to place LotRO fully under the umbrella of DBG. A gradual shift of the current population under a new revenue model and then have it become part of the DBG collective. Paying an all access fee to DBG. Why? Its a twofold purpose. One it yields security to SSG or so they think so. Two DBG adds to their portfolio and in turn spreads their losses if one of their existing games goes under. Basically this is spreading the damage and diluting the profits for SSG. SSG doesn't care how profitable the game is as long as they can screw around mind fucking their playerbase and still make a check. I suspect this transition was part of the deal when DBG and SSG negotiated their publishing deal. I said this before and still stand by it. WB owns LotRO the game. None of this transition is prohibitive to that assertion. Does WB care if LotRo floats or flounders? I doubt it. All it serves is to keep the license active with a purpose for the moment.

The recent monetization scheme is sad and now to a point where it is breaking the will of players to continue. At this point, I am just an observer. Watching this experiment mainly due to curiosity. Anyone with half a brain can see the manipulation at work here and I don't feel sorry one bit for the carrot chasers.

 

A new Legendary server and it doesn't have a new game engine. It isn't a 64 bit client. Why would players pay to lag on JUST another LotRO server? The answer makes my head spin.

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