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US Elections 2020

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Too lazy to get timestamps, but Knowles goes into a bit about some of the reasonign the founders had with how they set up impeachment, and how the Democrats (especially Schiff) are basically doing everything they can (either wittingly or not) to destabilize the US government.

 

8 hours ago, MueR said:

Actually 12 (or 13, not sure) of them are actually on committees that would have allowed them to be there. Matt Gaetz certainly is. It's just a publicity stunt. One by which they violated security protocols and possibly are criminally liable.

El Caudillo del Mar a Lago is becoming more unhinged by the day...

The Democrats have completely stonewalled the Republicans from cross examining the witnesses.  You'd think if this was a legitimate proceeding, then they'd allow the Republicans a chance to look into the evidence provided (which is pretty shaky to begin with), and then cross examine it... but the entire case they have against Trump would completely fall apart if it were actually tried like a real case in the House... which is what the Democrats are supposed to do rather than playing kangaroo court behind closed doors.

And yet... every single programmed liberal idiot on this forum is going to point out just how wrong I am and how wrong the Republicans are for trying to legitimize the impeachment proceedings... as that runs completely counter to their narratives.  I honestly swear the stereotypical Southern rednecks are smarter than the average Democrat these days.

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5 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

The Democrats have completely stonewalled the Republicans from cross examining the witnesses.  You'd think if this was a legitimate proceeding, then they'd allow the Republicans a chance to look into the evidence provided (which is pretty shaky to begin with), and then cross examine it... but the entire case they have against Trump would completely fall apart if it were actually tried like a real case in the House... which is what the Democrats are supposed to do rather than playing kangaroo court behind closed doors.

And yet... every single programmed liberal idiot on this forum is going to point out just how wrong I am and how wrong the Republicans are for trying to legitimize the impeachment proceedings... as that runs completely counter to their narratives.  I honestly swear the stereotypical Southern rednecks are smarter than the average Democrat these days.

This is the investigation into what transpired.  This is not the trial phase in the Senate, the time when "cross-examining" takes place.  There are 47 Republicans on the committees who have time to ask questions during the depositions.  Why is this so hard for people to grasp.  It is no different than what happens in a grand jury.  In the past they had special prosecutors administering the depositions, but in this case it is House committees.  They really need to return to teaching civics in school.

So allow this "programmed liberal idiot" to point out that you are in fact wrong.  You can go away now you worthless ball of dickhole lint.  You may return when you're right about something.

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7 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

Too lazy to get timestamps, but Knowles goes into a bit about some of the reasonign the founders had with how they set up impeachment, and how the Democrats (especially Schiff) are basically doing everything they can (either wittingly or not) to destabilize the US government.

 

The Democrats have completely stonewalled the Republicans from cross examining the witnesses.  You'd think if this was a legitimate proceeding, then they'd allow the Republicans a chance to look into the evidence provided (which is pretty shaky to begin with), and then cross examine it... but the entire case they have against Trump would completely fall apart if it were actually tried like a real case in the House... which is what the Democrats are supposed to do rather than playing kangaroo court behind closed doors.

And yet... every single programmed liberal idiot on this forum is going to point out just how wrong I am and how wrong the Republicans are for trying to legitimize the impeachment proceedings... as that runs completely counter to their narratives.  I honestly swear the stereotypical Southern rednecks are smarter than the average Democrat these days.

After reading this, I can't decide if you don't know how this process works, or if you're just casting bait. In either case, I need to stop interacting with you on this subject, until you learn civics or when the proceedings are done. You've gone from making assertions provided with information, to just blithering on about how its unfair. This in itself shows you can see the inevitable and how it pisses you off. You have to be right or your sunken cost has no payoff. I imagine that a tough cookie to swallow.

The only way out for Trump is to have every Republican Senator overtly subdue the laws in place and vote against impeachment because the president is a Republican. This act won't make it right or serve justice, but when has partisan politics ever served our country to arrive at the best outcome for its people? As for Trump the person, this guy will be going to jail after his term is over. The only salvation he will find is a Presidential Pardon from the next President.

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So yeah, more info comes forth, and the Trump administration is basically following the surveillance precedence set by the Obama administration:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/washington-secrets/trump-accuses-obama-of-treason-for-spying-on-his-2016-campaign

Like all of this stupidity, the Democrats pitch a hissy fit because they didn't get their way, do something that's detrimental to the US government, then scream like banshees when the Republicans do the exact same thing years later (and do it more effectively I might add).  The downside of having immature children as your political counterparts....

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5 hours ago, Splay said:

After reading this, I can't decide if you don't know how this process works, or if you're just casting bait. In either case, I need to stop interacting with you on this subject, until you learn civics or when the proceedings are done. You've gone from making assertions provided with information, to just blithering on about how its unfair. This in itself shows you can see the inevitable and how it pisses you off. You have to be right or your sunken cost has no payoff. I imagine that a tough cookie to swallow.

So what if I'm actually right, and you're too proud (or more likely too stupid) to realize it?

5 hours ago, Splay said:

The only way out for Trump is to have every Republican Senator overtly subdue the laws in place and vote against impeachment because the president is a Republican. This act won't make it right or serve justice, but when has partisan politics ever served our country to arrive at the best outcome for its people? As for Trump the person, this guy will be going to jail after his term is over. The only salvation he will find is a Presidential Pardon from the next President.

Would you like more tin foil for your hat?

6 hours ago, Amenhir said:

This is the investigation into what transpired.  This is not the trial phase in the Senate, the time when "cross-examining" takes place.  There are 47 Republicans on the committees who have time to ask questions during the depositions.  Why is this so hard for people to grasp.  It is no different than what happens in a grand jury.  In the past they had special prosecutors administering the depositions, but in this case it is House committees.  They really need to return to teaching civics in school.

If the investigation is basically a setup, then it's not a good investigation.  That's exactly what it looks like the Democrats have been trying to do and morons like you keep standing up for this partisan political hackery because you don't get allowing the house the precedence of throwing out when the President doesn't commit a crime unlike what Nixon did and Clinton (perjury - he lied under oath about Monica when people were looking into the sexual harrassment case IIRC).  If the House can set the precedence to impeach a President because it's the only way they know they can win 2020 (as of the Democratic 2020 candidates can't beat Trump because they're too far left), then that means (in the future) that if a political party does not like a candidate then they can throw them out regardless of the results of the election.  This kind of idiocy is really bad for the health of the country, but I'm not surprised as the Democrats have been on a fishing expedition for a way to get rid of Trump since he beat HRC years ago.

And the great thing, since it was not a classified meeting, many of those Republicans had a RIGHT to be there - and yet, they are still wrong because (as your simple mind would phrase it) "The Democrats are always right and the Repbulicans are always wrong".

This entire discussion has been like trying to talk to Flat Earthers about orbital mechanics...  Both sides think they're right, one side has convinced themselves of completely, illogical, bullshit.. unfotunately I'm surrounded by flat earthers....

6 hours ago, Amenhir said:

So allow this "programmed liberal idiot" to point out that you are in fact wrong.  You can go away now you worthless ball of dickhole lint.  You may return when you're right about something.

How about you grow up and learn to consider other points of view first?  To date, that seems like something you are wholly incapable of doing, which likely means you're likely too stupid to do so.

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1 minute ago, Almagnus1 said:

This entire discussion has been like trying to talk to Flat Earthers about orbital mechanics...

1 minute ago, Almagnus1 said:

How about you grow up and learn to consider other points of view first?

Incredible. Truly, incredible.

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The irony here is that the Democrats are following the procedures the Republicans drafted and approved of a few years back...but because it's their guy in the hot seat this time we are getting the political theatre we saw the other day. It's ridiculous and only meant to serve as a distraction.

Edited by Papi

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16 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

How about you grow up and learn to consider other points of view first?  To date, that seems like something you are wholly incapable of doing, which likely means you're likely too stupid to do so.

I considered your point of view in one of your first asinine posts.  You're still wrong.  Feel better now?

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What's interesting here isn't Alex Jones, but rather Roger Stone's perspective as he's been close to both the Nixon and Clinton impeachment.  Haven't watched the full interview (yet) but the the clips point out several weakenesses that the Republicans have, especially if they get cocky.

https://www.infowars.com/exclusive-roger-stone-talks-trump-impeachment-2020-election-ukrainegate-will-trump-resign/

And Stone is definitely right, Trump is hated precisely because he's not a politician.

2 hours ago, Doro said:

Incredible. Truly, incredible.

Damnstraight.  At least I have the stones to be up front about it, and not try some cowardly back channel intimidation bullshit.

2 hours ago, Papi said:

The irony here is that the Democrats are following the procedures the Republicans drafted and approved of a few years back...but because it's their guy in the hot seat this time we are getting the political theatre we saw the other day. It's ridiculous and only meant to serve as a distraction.

Which is exactly why the Democrats are basically doing a setup for impeachment.

They don't have anything, and they never had.  Only some gullible fool says otherwise.

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19 minutes ago, Almagnus1 said:

Damnstraight.  At least I have the stones to be up front about it, and not try some cowardly back channel intimidation bullshit.

I think people here have been pretty up front over how deluded they think you are.

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Doesn't make me feel anything. It isn't relevant. I just finished watching the video of Timhat. It contains nothing concerning the 2020 Presidential election. Also since, Timhat is your savior. Listen to what he says about "So what if I am, but what are you" circular arguments.

At best, it just shows dumb people making dumb choices. I always said for years. "The person who chooses to stand in the spotlight will be susceptible to scrutiny", whether they be a nobody, a Congressman/woman, or even a President.

The post and its link should be deleted or moved.

Get back on track and stop deflecting. Btw take a civics class. Quote me again before doing so, and I'll just ignore it. Show me you aren't a dumbfounded dipshit and offer something using logic and common sense.

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So something with impeachment that nobody is talking about, where's the due process?

The impeachments proceedings are supposed to be an open investigation into what Trump did and it's supposed to be conducted by both parties in the open (as it was with Clinton), not some "HE'S IMPEACHED!" stupidity that the Democrats want to carry out.  As it stands now, impeachment is naught more than a political play solely to improve the Democrats odds in 2020, and not about finding anything wrong with Trump.

9 hours ago, Splay said:

Doesn't make me feel anything. It isn't relevant. I just finished watching the video of Timhat. It contains nothing concerning the 2020 Presidential election. Also since, Timhat is your savior. Listen to what he says about "So what if I am, but what are you" circular arguments.

At best, it just shows dumb people making dumb choices. I always said for years. "The person who chooses to stand in the spotlight will be susceptible to scrutiny", whether they be a nobody, a Congressman/woman, or even a President.

The post and its link should be deleted or moved.

Get back on track and stop deflecting. Btw take a civics class. Quote me again before doing so, and I'll just ignore it.

How about you stop being a bad faith actor first?

Just because you're too stupid to see the connection doesn't mean it doesn't exist.  Trumps election can be impacted by whether or not several Democrats are convicted of ethics violations, especially if they happen to be key players of the impeachment brouhaha (like, say, if Schiff gets nailed for ethics violations).

That I even need to explain this only goes to show how much intelligence you lack because that kind of observation and analysis is so kindergarten and obvious that I shouldn't have to point it out.

So go ahead and ignore it, you seem to be good at doing that as you clearly are

9 hours ago, Splay said:

a dumbfounded dipshit

 

9 hours ago, Amenhir said:

<dumbassery>

Thank you for waving the white flag, you can set it down and go cry in the corner now instead of continuing to embarrass yourself.  If anything deserves to be moderated out of the thread, it's your last several responses because (as usual) you're not adding anything to the conversation and your trite, typically Democratic tactic of "if all else fails, cancel all the things" isn't going to work here.  You are the personification of everything wrong with the Democratic party, and that personification is exactly why you got Trump'd.

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Interesting, if California is suffering substantial infrastructure issues, that may be enough of a political opportunity for Trump to capitalize upon, giving him an advantage and (hopefully) more votes out of that state.  One of the things I have lived through is just how shitty Democrats are at running cities (like Seattle's a mess, San Francisco has become a modern medieval city, and life in California is pretty shitty if you don't do what the state wants you to do).

https://apnews.com/c95a246226c2466a968add8bd2392820

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I mean we are how many pages into this discussion and Almagnus still doesn't grasp how the impeachment process works and where in that process we currently are. So yeah...a willful denial of the facts has become the norm.

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43 minutes ago, Papi said:

I mean we are how many pages into this discussion and Almagnus still doesn't grasp how the impeachment process works and where in that process we currently are. So yeah...a willful denial of the facts has become the norm.

I know this is a rhetorical question, but I'm going to answer anyway.  There are those that are legitimately uneducated about the whole process.  There are people who know, but don't care.  Almagnus falls into this latter category.  We had the same kind of people running around when Obama ran for President.  The "He's a Muslim terrorist from Kenya" people.  They know it's not true, but the truth doesn't suit their narrative.   I suppose it's possible that he lives in a bubble and that everyone around him has the same point of view.  

I moved to a very red state in 2003.  Not once during the whole time Bush was president did I feel that I could be in danger for being a democrat.  I think at this point if I had a vote for Warren bumper sticker someone would vandalize my vehicle, or at worst, try to run me off the highway.  My father is a 70 yr old Christian Republican.  He's apologized more times for voting for Trump than he did for accidentally running over my foot with the car.

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whew, everyone seems to be an expert on the Impeachment process...

i wonder if any of you experts could tell me how many Impeached Presidents were removed from Office?

and the follow up to that first question...

what sort of timetable needs to transpire if the November 2020 election is to proceed unhindered? when do Democrats need to bring "Formal" charges AKA: articles of impeachment?

and am i correct that we aren't even at the point of charges making it to the floor of the house of representatives?

...

and lastly if Donald Trump is not "CONVICTED" before the 2020 election by a 2/3 majority in the Senate and manages to win in November 2020, but after...  does that not simply mean you are stuck with Mike Pence until 2024?

assuming of course Donald Trump wins in 2020.  😉

how does the Timetable work if you want to remove him before November 2020?

you'd think if they were solid with the votes, this thing would be moving forward, but hey, what do i know...   🤨

i'm sure this isn't all "Sound and Fury, signifying... people are distracted by noises.  i'll even add too:

the walls are closing in...

image.png.a77dc68aa63441b34ed40b6dee6d130d.png

 

 

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57 minutes ago, LasraelLarson said:

whew, everyone seems to be an expert on the Impeachment process...

i wonder if any of you experts could tell me how many Impeached Presidents were removed from Office?

 

I get where you are going with this, so I'll follow along and lead your question.

The answer is none by the completed impeachment process ending in a conviction determined by the US Senate and its presiding judge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Andrew_Johnson

Remained in office until his term expired

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Tyler#Impeachment_attempt

Remained in office until his term expired.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_process_against_Richard_Nixon

Resigned

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton

Censured and remained in office until his term expired.

 

Here is the most important lesson about why a President of questionable intent and practice becomes part of the Impeachment process.

The impeachment and trial of Andrew Johnson had important political implications for the balance of federal legislative–executive power. It maintained the principle that Congress should not remove the President from office simply because its members disagreed with him over policy, style, and administration of office. It also resulted in diminished presidential influence on public policy and overall governing power, fostering a system of governance which Woodrow Wilson referred to in the 1870s as "Congressional Government".[1] Johnson remained the only U.S. president to have been impeached for over a century, until Bill Clinton became the second in 1998.

 

The bold line above is the reason. To make a president a lame duck of sorts. To use force by a presiding judge's determination is avoided because our histories past recognized the impact of outright removal within and outside of the United States as a member of the world stage. With that said, no past President has even come remotely close to what Trump has done and continues to do. His blatant disregard for what a world leader should be and can be is an outright embarrassment. Far more than some guy getting a blowjob.

 

The real question to ask. Can a President run for a second term if they are impeached or censured?

 

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37 minutes ago, Splay said:

The real question to ask. Can a President run for a second term if they are impeached or censured?

that is a good question.  especially when currently. "Articles of Impeachment have NOT been brought to the floor.

but it would seem they can still run.

so kinda makes one wonder what is the game-plan?

EDIT:

had trouble finding this video.

anyway, if this is what insiders think about the current slate of Dem candidate hopefuls...  they don't have a clear front-runner that has mass appeal...  and they sure won't back Bernie Sanders.

so is the actual plan to hopefully eat away at Trumps voter base?  cause i don't see that working so well. 

sway public opinion in hopes of moving more of the Republican majority Senate?  those republicans won't budge prior to Nov. 2020 when at the very least they can still get Pence for 4 years.

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51 minutes ago, LasraelLarson said:

that is a good question.  especially when currently. "Articles of Impeachment have NOT been brought to the floor.

but it would seem they can still run.

so kinda makes one wonder what is the game-plan?

My understanding about why there hasn't been an official proceeding per the Articles is this.

They don't have to be invoked at the onset of the investigation leading to an impeachment. They will have to be eventually. The part about this not happening immediately is why some are pissed including Trump himself. The reason they aren't is because if a vote is set and passed, then Immediately Trump can invoke  attorney client privilege. Essentially eliminating Guiliani from the equation. Also Trump has other choices to put into play invoking Presidential Immunity, Executive Privilege, and a host of other choices usually reserved for sensible uses, as opposed to defensive strategies. By not putting a House vote in play from the start, ties Trump's hands for the moment. At least in these regards.

Trump has been advised on these intricacies and instead of playing a cool hand, he has gone apeshit bonkers. Further incriminating himself and in general making and ass of himself and in a larger perspective the United States as well. I see his twitter rages as a pure bonafide example of just how desperate and stupid this guy is and continues to be. Had he gotten all his ducks in a row verses being a dumbfuck, he might have been able to withstand this onslaught. Though, now that bridge has lost its piers.

So, as I see it, by the time Pelosi puts the Articles of Impeachment to the House floor, its a forgone conclusion Trump will be impeached and further be removed immediately. I say this because, the evidence is overwhelming and far too damaging, for the Senate Republicans to not vote against Trump. Currently it will only take 20 Republican Senators to vote for impeachment to have the 2/3 majority. Senators which many are career politicians who have their futures to consider. I'm not sure if the President of the Senate (Mike Pence) can break any ties being that it is presided over by a Supreme Court Justice.

Probably the worst in all this is, the Democrats have no one worth voting for and the Republicans haven't had any one willing to go against Trump to represent their party. It's a fuck all either way in any scenario. Considering this future, It might be a good time for a revolution that will destroy the political duopoly and remake the United States all together. Sure as hell burns, what we got isn't working anymore.

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5 hours ago, LasraelLarson said:

that is a good question.  especially when currently. "Articles of Impeachment have NOT been brought to the floor.

but it would seem they can still run.

 

Unless they specifically bar the individual from holding public office in the future, either during the impeachment or trial period, they can run again.  Alcee Hastings was impeached as a judge and then went on to become a US Rep.   A position he still holds.  It would be unlikely for a person to run for President due to the high profile nature.

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**falls out of the chair laughing**

 

18 hours ago, Papi said:

I mean we are how many pages into this discussion and Almagnus still doesn't grasp how the impeachment process works and where in that process we currently are. So yeah...a willful denial of the facts has become the norm.

Or maybe I do, and it's more convenient for you to believe that I don't?

Keep putting that head in the ground ostrich man.

14 hours ago, Splay said:

They don't have to be invoked at the onset of the investigation leading to an impeachment.

And that investigation has (historically) been pretty open and transparent... which it's not now....

The cloak and dagger style the Democrats have adopted for impeachment is what the Republicans are miffed about... and yet, if they actually go as transparent as they should their entire impeachment sham is going to fall apart.  You don't need shadows if you have the truth, as the truth will light the way.

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7 hours ago, Almagnus1 said:

The cloak and dagger style the Democrats have adopted for impeachment is what the Republicans are miffed about... and yet, if they actually go as transparent as they should their entire impeachment sham is going to fall apart.  You don't need shadows if you have the truth, as the truth will light the way.

There's no cloak and dagger. This is the process as per the rules that the GOP dictated in 2015. Similar to grand jury hearings, they're not open to the public. The public mind you, the GOP reps from certain committees can attend, ask questions and what not. They get as much time as any Democrat on the committee. They just lack any reasonable defense for Trump's obvious criminal actions and resort to publicity stunts such as "storming the hearing", which in itself is a criminal offense.

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