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COVID-19 (Coronavirus)

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https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-lashes-out-at-fauci-amid-criticism-of-slow-virus-response/ar-BB12wPbh?li=BBnb7Kz

Mr. Trump reposted a Twitter message that said “Time to #FireFauci” as he rejected criticism of his slow initial response to the pandemic that has now killed more than 22,000 people in the United States.

Trump will never admit fault. Not even at the risk of endangering lives. Only a moron would challenge the expertise of a tested professional in their chosen field. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Fauci lay it out in real terms to the Americans during the next live Trump campaign election hour briefing. When Trump interrupts Fauci, I liked to see the guy turn and tell Trump to stfu and let the professionals speak.

Meanwhile, meat production is coming to a halt. Meat processing workers are becoming ill with the Covid virus. Farmers can't find adequate amounts of feed for their livestock. Chicken and Turkey farmers are dealing with Avian flu. Killing millions of foul to contain isolated infected areas. And... still no progress on produce farmers getting enough labor to work their fields.

All through these past few months the only thing Trump gives a shit about is getting reelected. Firing Inspector Generals who point out failures in the system. Removing advisors who actually know what they are doing. Eliminating agencies and regulations, which are now seen as essential in an emergency. I can't but help to wonder if Trump is purposely destroying the US. At this point, Trump is a clear and present danger to the citizens of the US.

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1 hour ago, Splay said:

Trump will never admit fault. Not even at the risk of endangering lives. Only a moron would challenge the expertise of a tested professional in their chosen field. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Fauci lay it out in real terms to the Americans during the next live Trump campaign election hour briefing. When Trump interrupts Fauci, I liked to see the guy turn and tell Trump to stfu and let the professionals speak.

It has been entertaining to see Trump's uneducated ramblings and speculation on the pandemic get undermined every time Fauci speaks. I suppose it was only a matter of time before Trump started looking for someone other than himself to blame for looking like an idiot. He's already got contradicting himself down to a fine art.

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7 hours ago, Doro said:

I don't blame them. London is a shithole, Devon is comfy, and being locked up in your own home indiscriminately is ridiculous. If they want to choose to be outside, they should be perfectly free to do so. Who knows how long this totalitarian imprisonment is supposed to last? Best to start civil disobedience now before it's too late.

London is also the epicenter of the virus in the UK.  Staying at home will help to slow the spread and save lives.  It is not a hard thing that is being asked of people.  Sit on your arse and what TV

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25 minutes ago, cossieuk said:

Staying at home will help to slow the spread and save lives.

Unless they're climbing through the windows of vulnerable people's houses, popping out to enjoy the outdoors isn't going to put anyone at risk. There comes a point where being locked in your own home to protect people also locked in their own home is a bit redundant.

25 minutes ago, cossieuk said:

It is not a hard thing that is being asked of people.

It isn't if you're used to being inside. I could do it, my brother does it, some friends can do it, but it's not easy for a lot of people. Different situations and different personalities create different outcomes. An extreme one is my dad's family, who would now be hitching up to go travelling for the summer months and are now being blocked by police from being able to gather again with family or do the usual sorts of cash in hand jobs they're good at. Nothing is more important than family, and for a traditionally reclusive people to be blocked from that because of a disease affecting a fraction of society they won't ever meet, it's a tough ask.

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9 hours ago, Doro said:

Unless they're climbing through the windows of vulnerable people's houses, popping out to enjoy the outdoors isn't going to put anyone at risk. There comes a point where being locked in your own home to protect people also locked in their own home is a bit redundant.

You have to draw the line somewhere.  If it is ok to go somewhere remote as there is little risk, lots of people will start going to remote area, so the risk increases.  If you let one family do it, then other will follow.  Everyone needs to do their bit to protect those at risk.

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3 hours ago, cossieuk said:

You have to draw the line somewhere.  If it is ok to go somewhere remote as there is little risk, lots of people will start going to remote area, so the risk increases.  If you let one family do it, then other will follow.  Everyone needs to do their bit to protect those at risk.

My point is though that those at risk aren't out there, either. It's a bit like closing swimming pools to protect those who don't go swimming, or banning the use of PDFs to protect boomers that could never open them. Families could flock to Stonehenge to have a close-proximity coughing party, and those at risk are still safe inside.

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knowing the difference & how to successfully draw the line...   is key:

image.png.5a3783515d762fcde80913c7fe7cce4a.png

...

...

last i checked Taiwan wasn't welding people up inside their residences, or getting uncomfortable over suspicious crematorium activity, like the unnamed country that restricts their inclusion in the W.H.O & unironically the flash point for this disease.:


things are a bit different in the west...

flattening the curve was about mitigating the surge (limiting the number of concurrent infections) to prevent hospital and institutional collapse.

this virus has nicely highlighted the inadequacies & exposed those compensating for with tyrannical proclivities.


also  for those waiting on a vaccine...

Waiting for Godot | Summary, Characters, & Facts | Britannica.com

i don't expect success in this area...  ever.

...

to my viewing, the best hope is going to be cheap (not new and expensive!!!) therapeutics.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41421-020-0156-0


Damn that Bad Orange Man!

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1 hour ago, LasraelLarson said:

last i checked Taiwan wasn't welding people up inside their residences

To add to that, neither's Japan. Turns out that there is no ability for the government here to actually force a lockdown. All they can do is close certain state-owned tourist attractions and ask some entertainment-focused businesses to close, but they don't have to listen. People are asked to stay in where possible, but again they're free to go out without consequence. The unintended consequence of so many businesses and places like shrines and temples willingly closing or reducing hours is that there's larger gatherings happening in places like public parks. Perfect conditions to spread among the willing population, so I guess we'll have to see how that plays out.

Still, much like Taiwan, they're doing insanely better than pretty much all western countries that have gone the delayed-reaction police-state route. Are UK families having BBQs or going fishing the real threat, or is it the lockdown with the sheer number of collapsing businesses and massive hit to the economy, and an ineffective and under-funded national health system? Police kicking in doors to stop imaginary parties suggests the former.

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14 minutes ago, Doro said:

an ineffective and under-funded national health system? Police kicking in doors to stop imaginary parties suggests the former.

but if they lived in a certain neighborhood and repeatedly had visitations from female minors...  no door would have to live in fear of being kicked down.

examining the UK tally doesn't seem to highlight any success whatsoever...

88,621 cases  ~  11,329 deaths ...    12.7836517304%

not exactly exemplary.

& literally NO ONE is looking to UK for ideas RE: Chinese Virus...

so at least that is a plus side to all the panic based decisions on display there.  everyone else gets a clear snapshot of what NOT to do.


with regard to Japan...  hard to say if potential Olympics made for less than accurate data.  still better than UK, by orders of magnitude.

but for the Asian side, Taiwan really lead the charge and South Koreas response is in part thanks to Taiwan.

S. Korea did get on top of it, but early on, they were also caught by surprise.

Singapore was also pretty proactive, but that is par for the course there.

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On 4/14/2020 at 12:15 AM, LasraelLarson said:

the UK tally doesn't seem to highlight any success whatsoever...

88,621 cases  ~  11,329 deaths ...    12.7836517304%

93873 cases  ~  12107 ...   12.8972121909%

getting closer to 13%, UK is still on the uphill slope.  (as are most places with only a small few exceptions.)


Coronavirus (Gobal) timeline:

- January 19: 100 cases

- January 24: 1,000 cases

- February 12: 50,000 cases

- March 6: 100,000 cases

- March 18: 200,000 cases

- March 26: 500,000 cases

- April 2: 1,000,000 cases

- April 14: 2,000,000 cases

really makes one wonder how much more unrecorded is out there?  not to mention China undocumented tallies.

with all the shifting information regarding this new disease...  lets hope the 14 day incubation rule is also accurate.

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Well the spread really comes down to two factors:

1. How dense the population is.

2. How dense the population is.

We're doing the social distancing thing here in the Netherlands. At first most people weren't taking it too serious, but now that there's fines imposed on gathering in groups (to the tune of 400+ euros for individuals), people are finally taking note and doing the responsible thing.

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This is Covid-19 not Covid-1

There is nothing you can say to defend that level of stupidity.  She has the cheek to say the American people deserve the truth.  She wouldn't know the truth if it bitch slapped her

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10 hours ago, MueR said:

Well the spread really comes down to two factors:

1. How dense the population is.

2. How dense the population is.

i wonder how much data has been collected regarding open air transmission say Vs. closed environments?

i also wonder if time (or length of) exposure is a factor?  were viral load passes a threshold and a person goes from asymptomatic, to having symptoms?

regardless, this does seem to be a very communicable disease.  so one carrier will definitely have greater potential to transmit in a dense population.

 

On 3/12/2020 at 4:58 PM, Splay said:

I'd bet this particular virus has been traveling around the world since the beginning of this past winter, with 100s of millions already having been exposed to it. I chuckle when reading the rhetorical back and forth between the US and China. The funniest one was where China claimed the US purposely released the virus in Wuhan, all the while totally dismissing China's wet markets and factory farms are a breeding ground for evolving contagions.

yeah this was something i heard in passing as well...  which is rather odd to have Chinese sources dismiss a naturally adapting zoonosis, or cross species transmission in favor of a biologically manufactured agent.  such a claim would demand thorough investigation.  so making it for gullible people is a rather short sighted thing, considering if it does lead to demands for investigation...  especially when factory farms in the US... DO NOT include bats.

responding to this particular comment now however, as i have had something very recently pointed out to me, so sharing it here...

^this^ Chinese version for Arab TV

also has a Spanish Version,  African VersionAmerican Version,  French VersionRussian Version, as well as a Main Channel.

each version is different content targeted at those audiences.  it is interesting (enlightening even) to see the messaging aimed at different parts of the world from China.

was a little peculiar to see Bill Gates on the Russian version:

Bill Gates money is all over global medical initiatives, especially in Africa, so no surprise he is cozy with the W.H.O. and what also looks to be China...  what is disappointing is the things he is praising...

regardless CCP is heavily engaged in propaganda globally.

it is interesting to see who is hitching their wagon to the C.C.P.  not a wise move if you ask me. especially stupid if this virus does turn out to be lab manufactured!

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since i linked that Chinese hit piece in Arab above...

12 hours ago, LasraelLarson said:

you'd be amazed the heavy hitting stuff coming out of India aimed squarely at China i have avoided linking

might as well be the right time for this:

disappearing Doctors, who left a social media record, isn't the best look for an innocent (CCP) party...

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7 hours ago, cossieuk said:

This is Covid-19 not Covid-1

There is nothing you can say to defend that level of stupidity.  She has the cheek to say the American people deserve the truth.  She wouldn't know the truth if it bitch slapped her

Is she trying to say this is like the Fast and Furious franchise and we're on the 19th instalment? "Well they should know what to do, they've seen it 18 times before!" Nothing to do with the release date, then...

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16 hours ago, LasraelLarson said:

disappearing Doctors, who left a social media record, isn't the best look for an innocent (CCP) party...

$5 says this entire thing was a biological weapon research project that got out... and the West should retaliate by embargoing China back into the stone age while the Americas and Europe bring our industry back home.

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Just about every COVID-9 White House briefing is another attempt by Trump to gaslight the events of the past few months.

The latest being, he actually said he wished he was notified of the dangers sooner--when there is clear, video evidence of him being fully aware of the danger and completely downplaying them so that it wouldn't hurt his re-election.  In early/mid March he was saying that it was OK for people to go to work with the virus.  It's fucking ridiculous, but given the course of this presidency...not unexpected.

 

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oh my...  from July 2019:

 

Quote

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: In July 2019, a rare event occurred in Canada. Suspected of espionage for China, a group of Chinese virologists was forcibly evicted from the Canadian National Microbiology Laboratory (NML) in Winnipeg, where they had been running parts of the Special Pathogen Program of Canada’s public health agency. One of the procedures conducted by the team was the infection of monkeys with the most lethal viruses found on Earth. Four months prior to the Chinese team’s eviction, a shipment containing two exceptionally virulent viruses—Ebola and Nipah—was sent from the NML to China. When the shipment was traced, it was held to be improper and a “possible policy breach.”

^^^LINK^^^

most are familiar with Ebola, but here is the info for Nipah Virus


and now it would seem... a brand new narrative is being rolled out...  this was just completely innocent research into a treatment for aids... entirely altruistic and not in anyway a biological program and then...  Oopsie, turns out Huang Yanling is actually patient zero after all.  Given Chinas track record, lets just hope her involvement was actually an accident, rather than unwitting participant.

...

China coughed and lied... and the whole world caught this new Chimera Virus because of it.


exempting lying China who i am of the opinion is out in front by a significant order of magnitude...  here is a leading list of the highest rates of infected dying, by country:

image.jpeg.d00c05215772572b2197da346f7e53d1.jpeg

that is 8 countries currently with over a 10% fatality rate.  sadly it looks like as time proceeds, more will be joining that group.

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34 minutes ago, LasraelLarson said:

that is 8 countries currently with over a 10% fatality rate.

if China Virus was a lootbox, the odds on death being the prize...  currently in the UK 13 in 100 infected are rolling...

Boardgames, Kids, and [Character] Death - Father Geek

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So circling back to the US bailout, it's actually considered constitutional based off of the same clause that gives the US government the power of eminent domain (where they can basically buy your land to use for a freeway, for example) as granted by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution, specifically the bolded part:

Quote

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

As the business operation is considered private property (as far as the government is concerned in this case), this is seen as just compensation by the US government for shutting down everything.  It's also why the US government may have more than one bailout.  There's probably grounds for a constitutional challenge as I'm pretty sure the US founders never foresaw having to deal with a pandemic - but the optics on that challenge are so bad that I highly doubt anyone is going to try.

It's also something I really don't want to do more often than necessary because doing this type of bailout can cause massive inflation due to pumping a ton of money into the economy.

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4 hours ago, LasraelLarson said:

and now it would seem... a brand new narrative is being rolled out...  this was just completely innocent research into a treatment for aids... entirely altruistic and not in anyway a biological program and then...  Oopsie

and there is cause for this narrative.

pick a search engine & enter the terms,  "Human Immunodeficiency Viral Vector Pseudotyped with the Spike Envelope of Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus"

Results from: GOOGLE

Results from: BING

Results from: Duck Duck Go

you get an interesting history of genetic manipulation for those exact intentions.

then you have the Chinese virologist Shi Zhengli published paper from 2015 in Nature:

Quote

Using the SARS-CoV reverse genetics system2, we generated and characterized a chimeric virus expressing the spike of bat coronavirus SHC014 in a mouse-adapted SARS-CoV backbone. The results indicate that group 2b viruses encoding the SHC014 spike in a wild-type backbone can efficiently use multiple orthologs of the SARS receptor human angiotensin converting enzyme II (ACE2), replicate efficiently in primary human airway cells and achieve in vitro titers equivalent to epidemic strains of SARS-CoV

so all the way back in 2015 China had a synthetic SARS virus with psuedotyped AIDs spike envelope & engineered Bat Spike protein  that could infect humans... 

...

i might just believe this was all just an innocent mistake & China was merely trying to dominate the medical market on new vaccines and treatments, but for...

the MANY cover-ups.  disappearing Doctors & the shifting of blame... not just the US, but also Italy, and even Russia at one point. lifting viruses from other level 4 labs (Canada for certain.)

and if this was just a harmless (or even a strong one) flu...  why the hell did China go into hard lockdown, welding citizens inside their residences and aggressively sanitize/washing Wuhan on top of the above?

and AND when they restricted travel from Wuhan to the rest of China, they did not restrict travel to the rest of the planet.

AND AND AND  all the early figures and estimate models where based off info from the W.H.O. provided BY CHINA!

so that low death rate assumption that folk kept saying the common flu is more to worry about.  is based of China produced information.

it wasn't until all the waaay on March 11th that the W.H.O. declared the new disease a Pandemic.  up to that point they were tackling the stigmatization and xenophobia of naming Wuhan Virus, or Chinese Virus and praising Chinas handling of the situation.

on March 11th China accounted for 80% of the global numbers:

image.thumb.png.5355a2f315dae8cc560ddbfb39c3fb8b.png

 

given everything i have seen following this situation...   i was following it since around the middle of January 2020...   all the odd symptoms beyond just lung collapse from pneumonia, (immune system failure, hemorrhagic organ failure, neurological damage & nervous system malfunction) or the potential long term effects resulting from  infection...

the current global death rate is at 6.73%  much higher than that early 4% i kept hearing about.

this thing they created is aggressive as...  hell. 

this virus is synthetic, a "Chimera" & it came from (at least one) virology lab in Wuhan.

people need to stop carrying water for China.  & we need to seriously look at removing our collective dependence on them in the west.  & most of all we need to seriously look at the fact they are in a non conventional war with most of the Globe.

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23 hours ago, LasraelLarson said:

image.jpeg.d00c05215772572b2197da346f7e53d1.jpeg

that is 8 countries currently with over a 10% fatality rate.  sadly it looks like as time proceeds, more will be joining that group.

Looking at the death rate in the UK, just imagine what that would mean if the UK had went with the governments original plan of herd immunity.  65 million people, with a 60% herd immunity.  That is 39 million people.  With a 13% death rate that is over 5 million dead.

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